In this Study Manual we have been discussing Israel’s history and her prophetic future. Jesus said the end times would be like the days of Noah and Genesis 6 tells of some events which led to the flood of Noah. So we are going to review the differing viewpoints on those events outlined in Genesis 6:1-4 to determine, if the Nephilim, translated giants in the KJAV or distinguished in the CLV were the children of angels and mortal women…and determine whether this was fact or fiction.
I am using The Companion Bible for my KJAV source and I will compare with The Concordant Literal Version and I may refer occasionally to The Jewish Study Bible
Let’s read Genesis 6:1-4 in first the KJAV and then the CLV translation. I have underlined the different statements that we are going to investigate in this article.
1. “And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them.
2. That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair: and they took them wives of all which they chose.”
3. “And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.”
4. “And there were giants in the earth in those days: and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, The same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”
Let’s next compare this with The Concordant Literal Version by A. E. Knoch
Genesis 6:1-4 1. “And coming is it that humanity starts to be multitudinous on the surface of the ground, and daughters are born to them.”
2. “And seeing are the sons of the alueim the daughters of the human, that they are good, and taking are they for themselves wives of all whom they choose.”
3. “And saying is Ieue Alueim, Not abide shall My spirit in the human for the eon, in that moreover he is flesh. And come shall his days to be a hundred and twenty years.”
4. “Now the distinguished come to be in the earth in those days, and, moreover, afterward, coming are those who are sons of the alueim to the daughters of the human, and they bear for them. They are the masters, who are from the eon, mortals with the name.”
I have chosen four men’s articles on Genesis 6:1-4 which represent the viewpoints that differ, mainly in two areas. (1) Who were the sons of God in Verse 2 and (2) Who were their offspring or children which are said to be the Nephilim or giants, the men of renown of Verse 4? We will also look at the differences in the translation of this passage as you will notice when we compare the two. I will present the articles of these men in this order, Vladimir Gelesnoff, A.E. Knoch, Dr. Bullinger and Alexander Thomson.
Bullinger’s notes and Appendixes in the Companion Bible will help with the KJAV source but with the Concordant Literal Version I had to do a little more digging to find out why Knoch chose certain wording.
I also checked Rotherham’s Emphasized and Scofield’s…Scofield rejected the literal view while Rotherham’s had no notes on this passage, he did have as a subtitle, the sin of the day was the intermarrying of two races. His translation has the sons of God in Verse 2 and giants in Verse 4 so it appears he accepted the literal view.
As I said there are two basic things said in Genesis 6:1-4 which are disputed as to their meanings as well as being translated differently which are the foundation of this passage and so it is important to find the correct translation and meanings in order to understand what we are being told.
Again, these are, (1) who were the sons of God or sons of the alueim of Verse 2 and (2) who were the children or offspring of these sons, in Verse 4 translated as the giants in the KJAV taken from the name, the Nephilim or as in the CLV by Knoch who preferred to use the distinguished.
There are several theories as to who the sons of God in Genesis 6:2 were. (1) Angelic beings, while those disagreeing will say, (2) that these sons were men as men are also the sons of God and so we will do a lengthy review of this to see if in the Old testament that is really true.
The third view concerning the sons being men descended from Adam is that these sons were the leaders of men at that time and this is the reason Knoch did not capitalize alueim in this passage….as the definition is a chief or leader and when not capitalized it refers to false gods, men and even leaders of a herd of animals.
In the Concordant Pentateuch, the notes for both these verses state that “the firstborn sons of Seth or firstborn sons in Seth’s line” but no evidence is given in the context to support this so I kept looking.
Bullinger notes state that in the Hebrew the passage reads “sons of the Elohim = the creator,” So we compare this to how Knoch translated Verse 2 as, the sons of the alueim. Knoch decided this was not speaking of the sons of God but instead being, the sons of the leaders of men, more precisely the firstborn sons of Seth. This is important for us to understand who is correct as it is the foundation of the passage.
Our first question, were these sons of God…angelic beings, or human sons?
This is an important question as it then relates to who their children or offspring would have been. In what we will call the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 these sons are believed to be angelic beings who married human women, they would then have produced children, given the name of Nephilim which is translated giants in the KJAV. It is believed these are the sinning messengers of Jude 6.
While the other views are that these sons of God even if speaking of Elohim for the creator are humans as they too are sons of God or with Knoch’s view these were the sons of the alueim and were the chiefs or leaders of men as the first born sons of Seth and so the children born from this union would have been humans translated in the CLV as the distinguished. So those are the basic views now for some additional information needed to help us understand this subject and the translations.
There are two things to also get clear in our minds and that is first the definition of Elohim or Alueim and second, why two different spellings. First we should understand that Elohim or Alueim, is a title and not a name, it is defined as the chief or leader and can be given to God, gods, men as leaders or chiefs and even to the leader of a herd of animals.
Next we need to understand why the two different spellings of this title, as we find Elohim in the KJAV notes and as Alueim in the CLV. The different spelling is tied to the Hebrew and the Aramaic languages as the Old Testament was written and copied in both languages as we know from our earlier studies in this Manual much of Daniel was written in Chaldee or the Aramaic language.
Also due to the fact that the Israelites spent 400 years in Egypt and later when conquered by Babylon they were schooled in the Chaldee language…so we have Hebrew and Chaldee and then the Aramaic is said to be a dialect of both. The scriptures were copied by their scribes through out the years into the languages the people used.
When I quote from the KJAV and Bullinger’s notes we will see Elohim versus the Concordant which uses Alueim in Genesis, while I noticed in later books of the CLV Knoch used Elohim and most likely tied to the two languages…but keep in mind they are the same word for God as the creator…one is Hebrew the other Chaldee or Aramaic, think of it like this, Elohim, Alueim or we will also see the use of El and Al, the shortened form relating to the top God or god and as such we use God and gods in the English language.
Bullinger provided excellent information on the name and titles of God which explains this title and others in The Companion Bible, Appendix 4. In the KJAV English translation we find only GOD, God, LORD, or Lord instead of His name Jehovah or the differentiating when one of His titles was being used. So in the English translations the multifaceted work and character of God has been hidden as they are explained through the use of His many titles and His name.
The name Yahweh or Jehovah is from the tetagramatin, YHVH…which has the definition of…I shall be whatsoever I shall become and Hebrews 1:1 tells us that God appeared in many modes or diverse manner and the author says today He has appeared in a sonly way or as the Son. Jehovah and Christ are one and the same person interacting with humanity, and all of His creation in different modes. This is something which needs to be understood and knowing the titles and name God uses helps us to do so. In Study Manual Four in progress now, I have devoted it to this subject of God and it is titled…Who is our God.
What is also good about the Companion Bible are the notes along side the passages of scripture and so each one with GOD or God and LORD or Lord, Bullinger puts in his notes the Hebrew name or title used in the text which lets the reader know what title was used, El or Al or Elohim or Alueim. These titles, which GOD has used, denote a specific work in creating or with His sovereignty and His purpose of the ages
Also Bullinger’s notes will shows each time, when the name of God, Ieue, Yahweh or as in the English language, Jehovah is in the text. In the King James we find the name of God as Jehovah only three times…when in fact in the original scrolls it is there over 6000 times!
In the CLV of Genesis 6:1-4, Knoch decided that Verse 2 was not the sons of God but the sons of leaders of men and so he translated it as sons of the alueim…not capitalizing the title. We will look into this in more depth further on to see if he was correct in doing so. It is important in our understanding of this passage to first figure out who were the sons of God, angelic beings or humans as that then would have a bearing on who or what were their offspring or children as referred to in Verse 4.
So the question is then how do we know when this title Elohim or Alueim applies to God, gods, men or animals? Of course that would depend on the context. But in this case in our study we might also follow the rule of going to the first use of a word in the Hebrew Scriptures for its definition.
And in Genesis the first time this title is used by Holy Spirit is at Genesis 1:1 “In a beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.” KJAV In the Concordant Literal Version we see in the beginning Alueim created….while I recently received the new large Concordant Pentateuch, and noticed that it now reads Elohim and not Alueim.
But the point being in Genesis its first use was defined for us as Elohim for God the Creator. And this use continued all through the creation account right up to Genesis 6 which is where Knoch decided it no longer applied to the creator but instead switched to speaking about the leaders of men although there is nothing said in the context to alert us to this and so this troubled me and I kept investigating. I looked through the following passages in Genesis to see if there were any more times that men were said to be the leaders or chiefs and thus alueim and I found none and so this bothers me that in this one instance that title would switch from God the creator to men?
The only explanation I could find by Knoch for his choice of not capitalizing alueim and thus making this a reference to men and not God was the footnote for Genesis 6: 2 “elohim: arbiters or judges (as in Exodus 21:6): here the firstborn sons named in 5:6-31” In reading the fifth chapter I could not find one mention of any of those men being a chief or arbitrator with the use of the title of elohim being given them?
On Genesis 6: 4 we see the other difference Knoch made with the translation of distinguished verses the KJAV use of giants. The notes again in the Concordant Pentateuch says these were “mortals of renown; firstborn sons in the line of Seth who had wedded Adam’s daughters so as to strengthen their position as arbiters.” I can find nothing said in the context of this chapter or the previous chapters which would even hint at this? Knoch disagreed with the rendering accepted by most scholars and so we are going to try and understand why and if he was correct in his assumption
On Verse 4 Bullinger notes states; “the name used of the children born by the women which these sons took for wives is the Nephilim from the root nph and was translated as giants in the KJAV, he also said the name should have just been used in the text as was in the scrolls and not translated to something else”
The KJAV translators used giants instead of the name Nephilim because of the Septuagint version as well as because of the descriptions given in later scriptures for those with that same name or a derivative of it. When Israel was on the edge of the promised land of Canaan, they sent in spies to asses their enemy, which God had told them they were to kill or run out of that land.
The spies came back terrified saying they were like grasshoppers in comparison to the people in the land because the inhabitants were large or tall men with a warrior type nature and as such giants…from the same nph…used for Nephilim in Genesis. Again we are going to go through all of these passages of scripture further on as we go through this review.
This name Nephilim like the title for God the Creator is also spelt two ways, reflecting the influence of either the Hebrew or the Chaldee. So I have seen it spelled as Nephelim as well as Nephilim. In the Hebrew it comes from the root nph as “naphal” and means the fallen or fallen ones.
Knoch questioned the spelling and chose to go a different route, saying the passive form fit better, which would be nphil meaning, distinguished… this leans towards the Chaldee. I could not understand what other evidence he used to base his choice on until I researched the Sethite view which is found in the first article by Vladimir Gelesnoff. We are going to look at that view with its origins a little further on.
When the Septuagint Translation was made, Nephilim was translated with the Greek name of “gegenes” which means “earth born.” The Septuagint is the translation of the Hebrew scrolls into the Greek language by Jewish Rabbis, about 200 years before Jesus was born. Why did they translate the scrolls into Greek, it was because they were dominated by the Greeks and that was the common language of the time and many Jews scattered throughout the Grecian, Roman Empire grew up speaking Greek.
Why did they translate Nephilim with the name of gegenes? Because that was a common belief in the Greek world at the time of some beings, or gods who were not totally mortal or human, the name used in Greek mythology for the “Titans” who were gods in their myths or legends, being partly of celestial and partly of terrestrial or of human origin…and who were also of an immense stature….giants.
I think we also need to first understand that myths and legends had their beginnings in actual events. Just as Satan appeared to Eve, many of his followers appeared to humanity early on…and of course these spirit beings superior to humans in many ways and thus accepted as gods which were exhibiting knowledge of the Universe and powers which caused humanity to worship them.
This was also not unusual for the Jewish Rabbis or people of that era to adapt a Greek name or term to something in the scriptures…Peter did the same with his reference to where the sinning messengers were being kept by God, in Tartaroo or Tartarus. This too is actually the name of a gloomy cavern beneath the earth or under the waters of the oceans in Greek mythology. 2 Peter 2:4.
Does this give some credibility to a Greek myth for Peter to use it in referring to an actual Biblical event….I think it does? Later we will link what he and Jude had to say concerning the sinning messengers locked away in some sort of prison, using the Greek name Tartaroo or Tartarus from the time of the Noahic flood.
Even our own Apostle Paul used the Greeks belief in multiple gods to explain to them about the unknowable God that they had erected a monument too in fear of missing a god. The beliefs in multiple gods are also based in truth…again referring back to the sinning messengers appearing to humanity in order to mislead and be worshipped, was the beginning of idolatry in the days before the flood.
So in Paul’s discourse given to these Greek philosophers, he referred to a poet they were familiar with who had written a poem in which he refers to humanities relationship with God as being the kin, race or offspring of God. Paul’s speech is found at Acts 17:22-29. Paul too, gave creditability to this poet by telling them the Creator of whom, mankind was kin, offspring or of the same race was the unknowable God, (Jehovah) they had erected a monument too, and He was indeed their Creator.
Paul also in his letters teaches us that the Creator took on flesh and entered humanity as their redeemer and Savior and fulfilling Genesis 3:15, which was very important!
Returning now to our study of Genesis 6:1-4 we will look at the different explanations given by the four men, Vladimir, Knoch, Bullinger and Thomson as to who were the sons of God that married the daughters of men and who or what were their children or offspring, a race of giants or just wicked humans. We will also thoroughly investigate those who are rightfully said to be the sons of God in the Old Testament but before we do that lets look at the article written by Vladimir which will begin to give insight on the Sethite view…that Knoch seem to base his translation on.
Vladimir Gelesnoff wrote his articles in 1916 and they can be found in Volume 8 of the Unsearchable Riches….Pages 5-13, 51-62, 99-107, 163-178, 213-220, 255-266 As I said, it appears his series was not finished because he died in 1921 after a long illness. In his articles he also did not accept the literal view of Genesis 6 and instead puts forth other views and explanations.
Vladimir Gelesnoff gave his first view as that the Nephilim or giants were not Adam’s descendants or the offspring of spirit beings marrying mortal women but were instead a pre Adamic race living on the earth and by Adams descendants intermarrying with this other race is what corrupted Adams offspring and thus all had to be destroyed. We are told nothing of any other human life on earth when God began the re creating process and preparing the earth for humanity in Genesis 1 and according to the first 10 verses the earth was covered in water? There is also no recorded commandment warning of any other races in the earth nor are there any recorded commandments on who they could or could not marry?
Gelesnoff also put forth the idea that Adam and Eve only had male children for quite some time up to Genesis 6 this is also without scriptural texts for proof. When looking at Chapter 6 the word is ha adamah for the man Adam and so he felt it was speaking only of the direct daughters of Adam and of their being more beautiful than other women and for this reason they were desired by this pre Adamic race of men…which is who he believed the Nephilim could have been. We need to keep in mind that Adam was the patriarchal father and so all sons and daughters were referred to as his children as they were in his lineage.
To accept that Adam and Eve had no daughters until Chapter Six would mean there had to of been another race on this earth as who would Cain and Seth and Adams other sons have married if they had no sisters until Chapter six? But I could find no scriptural backing for Vladimir’s theory on this.
A.E. Knoch in his later article written in 1931 after Vladimir’s death in the first paragraph wrote, “many readers wanted the series finished and a review of the early articles Vladimir had written and confirmed by Knoch which were, except for the later articles on the Nephilim and the Rephaim which were found untenable”
In the account of Cain we read of his murdering his brother Able and his consequent banishment from living by Eden…it tells us he is in fear of being sent away saying anyone finding him may decide it was okay to kill him. Cain as we know was out of favor with God for killing his brother and was sent out to wander in the earth by Jehovah, which he did not do, instead he settled in the Land of Nod, east of Eden and the account says he had a wife and built a city at Genesis 4:9-17 and his sons are also named in that chapter.
Verse 17 says “Knowing Cain his wife and she is pregnant and brings forth Enoch.” This was not the Enoch of Jude. Seth was born about 100 years later and the Enoch in Jude was his son and a prophet of God. So who was Cain’s wife, he had to have married one of his sisters or a daughter of one of his brothers which would mean they had married sisters and thus Adam and Eve did have daughters very early on.
The only other alternative is to accept Vladimir’s view of a pre adamic race and that would mean Adams sons took wives from another race and they would have also been the others Cain feared? But again no scriptural proofs to support this….it is speculation.
But for that matter if Vladimir’s idea was true would not Seth’s wife also have been from this supposed pre adamic race and would not that then have tainted the line from Adam said to be the righteous line? Or is he saying only Seth married one of his sisters and that is why his line was righteous? These theories are speculative and based on secular reasoning and so seem to go in circles with no scriptural evidence!
We have to accept Paul’s words found at Acts 17:24-27 which tells us God created the heavens and the earth and that all generations of humanity came from one man. The scriptural account given is that the first human pair was Adam and Eve and all inhabitants of this earth descend from them.
So since we are told Cain had a wife and so he either took a sister with him when he traveled to Nod or when he got there he found a niece to marry who would have been a daughter of one of his brothers. But my point being, a wife is spoken of in Chapter 4 for Cain and Vladimir based his argument on there being no daughters born to Adam and Eve until Chapter 6 .
Another view Vladimir spoke of is called the Sethite View, This view is that Seth, one of Adams sons said to replace Able was the good son and Cain was the bad son and so Genesis 6 is speaking of Seth’s firstborn sons marrying Cain’s daughters and they were not suppose to do that. But again I have found no proof for this in the scriptures or any record of a commandment given against these two sons’ lines intermarrying.
But I did find the origin of the Sethite View; it can be attributed to the Catholic Church adopting this view between the 3rd and 5th centuries. In my research I found that contrary to this view history shows previous to the 3rd century the literal view of Genesis 6 was commonly believed and that it had always been accepted by the Rabbinical society, and by the early church fathers.
The “Sethite” teaching as the explanation for Genesis 6 originally began with Julius Africanus and Origen and Augustine accepted it and so that theory flourished during the Middle Ages and it is still accepted today by many denominations especially those who lean towards spiritualizing the scriptures. The origin of the “Sethite” theory with its connection to the Catholic Church should cause us to examine it for sure. Those who spiritualize do need to invent myths to explain the alternative theories they come up with.
From the third century forward, Augustine taught that the Bible was not to be taken literally and began spiritualizing things, we have brought out before how he taught there was no Second Advent of Christ or Millennial kingdom to come on this earth. He was one of the first to teach Christ came invisibly in A.D. 70 when Jerusalem was burnt to the ground and that the Jews were cast off forever. Remember Augustine is the father of spiritualizing scripture and denying prophesy yet unfulfilled and he accepted the Sethite view as an alternative explanation for Genesis 6:1-4.
So this Sethite view teaches that Seth was the righteous line and Cain’s was the unrighteous line and they were not to intermarry or for those believing in the pre adamic race they were not to intermarry with them.
With Vladimir’s view, of Adam and Eve having no daughters till Chapter Six makes no sense. Adams sons would have had to of married, the other race of which we are told nothing of? With his view then Seth and or his sons would marry the now arriving daughters of Adam, his sisters. If Seth was the righteous line why would he have married the forbidden sisters? Where did Noah get his wife? None of that view makes sense.
Knoch’s view is slightly different as he did not agree with the no daughters theory till Chapter 6 and he explains that the term ha adamah must refer to Adam but that it could refer to all daughters born to Adam’s sons as being his daughters as Adam was the Patriarchal father.
But Knoch still held to the Sethite theory saying sons of the alueim were the firstborn sons of Seth and were the leaders or chiefs and so the taking wives of the ha adamah either Adams directly or his descendants daughters, with their children becoming the men of renown and distinguished of which he does not explain leaders of what or who, only that the distinguished were the firstborn sons of Seth?
If the sin and wickedness going on in that time was that which is natural to humans and God is all knowing of the nature of humanity as its Creator why did He feel regret or sadness at having created them? So much so that He brings a flood to wipe all flesh, men and animals off the earth? For me there is a piece to this puzzle that is missing.
Perhaps this is why Vladimir stresses Adams did not have daughters for a long time and when he did they were very desirable? But how did this become the wickedness that brought so much violence and evil, that all flesh, even the animals had to be removed.
We have already discussed how implausible those views are as there is no scriptural support and something as important or crucial certainly would have been explained and at the very least the commandment of who to marry and not marry would have been put in the record? The context of Genesis does give us the reason for the coming destruction….we just need to understand what was said and since nothing was said about breaking any rules on who to marry or not marry….there must be another answer!
Also a close examination of the line of Seth and Cain’s lines indicates there were those who were good and bad in both. It appears Enos in Seth’s line seems to have begun the profanation of God’s name. Genesis 4:26 “And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.”
Bullinger’s notes on this passage, says this was “Not a beginning to worship, Jehovah, for Abel worshipped and others, doubtless, long before. But here; ‘began to call upon (their gods) by the name of Jehovah or began profanely to call upon the name of the Lord, Enos, though the son of Seth, is included in this section (which deals with Cain’s descendants)….because he went in the way of Cain.” In opposition to Jehovah.
If you will note Bullinger’s comments in the margin notes of Genesis 4 which is giving the account of Cain and then Verse 17 gives Cain’s lineage and is then followed by a brief reference to Seth and Enos which stands out as it falls within the context of the lineage of Cain…and so this is the reason Bullinger said, “Enos went in the way of Cain…” and this calling on the name of God was not in faith but was in rebellion. This bears up as Seth’s story and his lineage are given separately in the following Chapter 5 which gives his lineage to Noah.
We can also find in Cain’s line some of his descendants have the name of God, el or al as part of their names, which is regarded as done by those who believed in or followed Jehovah. And if Seth’s line was the righteous line why was all of it destroyed in the flood except for Noah’s family of 8 persons?
Yes, the name Seth means appointed or set one and so that is very interesting, we know Noah was in Seth’s line and when we trace the genealogy given for Jesus, He is in the line of Seth, as Noah’s family the only one which survived the flood, but I find it hard to believe, Seth had no other descendants alive when the flood came? But I wonder since God is always in control even when the world and circumstances seem to be out of control, if He saw to it that certain men were protected from Satan’s lies and corruption.
All of Seth’s line could not have been righteous or else they would not have perished in the flood but been saved with Noah. But the Sethite theory denies the literal view of Genesis 6 and attributes Verse 2, the sons of God as being Seth’s line, and whose children were renowned for something…? The context speaks of wickedness and corruption so much so…God planned the flood.
As said earlier the Sethite view comes from the Catholic Church and as it grew in power, being a state religion, what ever the emperor believed that was what was mandated as gospel! So religion was monitored and what disagreed with the state religion was censored as to what the common believer was allowed to know or understand about God’s Word. The idea of angels cohabiting with women was shocking and that teaching would also conflict with their worship of angels and the doctrine of celibacy.
Yes the Catholic Church made statues of angels…like Gabriel and taught when humans go to heaven they become angels. They made a statue of Mary and encouraged praying to her, when she is still asleep in the dust of the ground this is another example of idolatry and constitutes the worship of idols although the Catholic Church will deny it. So by the 5th century Genesis 6 was commonly accepted and explained with the Sethite theory.
With this information about the origin of the Sethite viewpoint and in referencing back to Knoch’s words of deciding to use sons of men, (alueim) and distinguished instead of giants or Nephilim with no other proofs given other than his own words as “it fit better.” I have to say at this point and in my opinion what it fit was that Knoch accepted the Catholic indoctrinated Sethite view and explanation of Genesis 6:4.
So I wondered at how influenced were Vladimir and Knoch by the standard teaching of the Sethite View from the 5th century on down to our time. Is that why they could not accept the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 and so looked for alternative explanations and ways to translate this passage?
Since I am not a scholar or a language expert, nor do I have access to the texts Knoch did nor the ability to read them if I did….all I can do is investigate all the evidence I can find and see if the truth will become evident. One way is to review what the viewpoint states and if it has credible support or not…if it does not…then the other viewpoint needs looking at.
The next article Vladimir Gelesnoff wrote is found on Page 51 of this same Volume 8; The Sons of God. In it, he continues his argument based on his premise from the first article and goes on to dispute the sons of God as being anything but humans. He maintains that humans are said to be the sons of God in the scriptures along with spirit beings but does not go into the contexts of when and why humans are called sons of God. But we will do that further on in this study.
One other thing Vladimir said in this article, which I am also not able to comprehend….was that the “daughters taken were directly from Adam and Eve as they ..obviously must have been more beautiful than the other women on the earth and that was the distinction or purpose of that statement in Genesis 6.
The third article Vladimir wrote is found on Page 99 “The Death Sentence.” In it, he refers to the wickedness in the earth bringing on the flood was due to “gross immorality and forbidden degrees of consanguinity and “mismarriages” Now I looked up the word consanguinity and it has to do “with a close connection of the same blood” He must be referring to brother and sisters marrying, but I have to ask, what else were they to do? Oh I forgot he thought there was another race on the earth.
Certainly when Jehovah told them to multiply and fill the earth if any restrictions were needed we would read of them but there are none and if there was another race on the earth in the beginning and they were not to marry why is there is no record given. Since we are only told of Adam and Eve and the begetting of children and of them begetting their children who else could they have married but their own their sisters?
But that seems to be Vladimir’s position and why he believed the marriage unions spoken of in Genesis were between humans only and somehow this was so wicked as to cause God to bring the flood?. Now this makes no sense to me at all as they were told to marry and fill the earth and there is no record of such a command? I cannot imagine mankind’s intermarrying being what was so wicked as to cause Him regret for having created them.
If we are correct in our belief that God is in control, all knowing as one of His omni powers, then we have to ask how could anything that was done by His own creation be a surprise? He would know of any and all sin humanity could come up with, and so it seems to me that something far more evil than Cain and Abel’s children getting married and having children must have been the issue.
If Vladimir’s reasoning were true I find it hard to understand why God brought the Noahic flood to deal with the sin of intermarriage of humans, of idolatry and wickedness by humanity. The natural progression of the dying process is the wages of sin. My goodness Cain killed his brother and God just sent him away and his actual punishment seems to be that the promised seed would not come through his lineage as Adams firstborn son. Over 100 years later, Seth is born and it is through his lineage that seed will eventually come.
So, it would seem that something far greater occurred in that early world needing the extreme judgment from God of wiping all flesh off the earth. For me the interference by Satan and his messengers with Adams progeny, attempting to thwart the promised seed fits far better! Satan would want to prevent the foretold seed which was said by Jehovah would come from Eve and that seed was going to redeem humanity and also crush Satan’s head. So, it is logical Satan would want to prevent the promised seed from entering the world of humanity and thus he would focus on Adam and Eve’s lineage. Genesis 3:15
Vladimir’s fourth article in Volume 8, Page 163 addresses what Bullinger said about the term in Genesis 6:4 “There were giants, (Nephilim) in the earth in those days: and also after that, when the sons of God went in unto the daughters of men and they have children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”
Vladimir stated, “that it is wrong to imply the “and also after that” as referring to after the flood as the flood had not yet occurred so why would the writer refer to something happening after an event which had not happened yet? So the question is who wrote Genesis by his logic he must have assumed Noah did?
I am confused by the logic of his statement, did Noah write Genesis? We are told Moses wrote Genesis centuries after the flood as well as after Moses died Jewish Priests added to these books concerning things which Moses foretold when they came about. One quick example is in Deuteronomy; Moses is not describing his own death and burial that was added later by others, it is thought much of Deuteronomy was written by others.
Bullinger has some good information which explains what was said in Verse 4, the subject of that sentence is that there were giants (the Nephilim) in the earth…in those days and also after that…..implying that later there were again giants in the earth after the flood of Noah. Bullinger says this was a second irruption. We will go through this view further on but to prepare us for this...Bullinger gives many scriptures to back this up.
The writer of Genesis 6 knew what and who was being referred to and implied…the Nephelim were in the earth before the flood and …also after the flood. The CLV says the distinguished were in the earth before the flood and also after that…yet the notes say, the firstborn sons of Seth are the distinguished…how were they…alive…after the flood?
Vladimir said, “the Nephilim were not Adams descendants…but were on the earth centuries before Adam and Eve were placed in the Garden of Eden.” So he rejects the sons of the Alueim as being the sinning messengers referred to by Peter and Jude and believes instead that they were a race of some kind of humans already on the earth before and while God created Adam and Eve, yet he gives not one scripture for proof…that is because there are none.
This theory is harder for me to understand than the literal viewpoint? Doesn’t his theory disagree with the words found at Acts 17:24-29 “The God Who makes the world and all that is in it, He, the Lord inherent of heaven and earth, is not dwelling in temples made by hands, neither is He attended to by human hands, as if requiring anything, since He Himself gives to all life and breath and all.”
Besides, He makes out of one, every nation of mankind, to be dwelling on all the surface of the earth, specifying the setting of the seasons and the bounds of their dwelling, for them to be seeking God, if, consequently, they may surely grope for Him and may be finding Him, though to be sure, not far from each one of us is He inherent, for in Him we are living and moving and are, as some poets of yours also have declared, ‘For of that race also are we.’ The race, then is inherently of God; we ought not to be inferring that the Divine is like gold, or silver, or stone, a sculpture of art and human sentiment.”
The key point being that “out of one (man, Adam) came all the nations to be dwelling on the earth” So how can we accept that the Nephilim were a race of humans, living on this earth before Adam was created and were still living on this earth at the same time God created Adam and Eve? Also, Paul told us, that all in Adam were dying and that same all would be made alive in Christ….what of these supposed, other humans who were not in Adams lineage, if alive on this earth…why would Christ’s death not cover them?
I found much of what Vladimir wrote unprovable and speculative, but research shows that the theory of a pre Adamic race did not begin with him. A pre adamic race and or races is believed by many today tied with evolution and so I thought we should be familiar with it. Many also believe the Eden account is a myth and or is to only be viewed spiritually and so they have no problem with pre adamic races on this earth. We who are bound by the Word of God find no support for this theory and so must dismiss it.
Vladimir gave no scriptural proof for the alternative theories he put forth in his articles and I can find none…thus was speculation on his part based on the science of his day and which is still being taught today although expanded on due to the recent technology of DNA which has now shown the Neanderthal man was alive when Homo sapiens were already on the earth and so does not support that modern man evolved from them and in fact this technology is showing there was also very possible, intermarriage.
Years ago when evolution began to be taught based on bones and skulls uncovered in archeological digs which were very different from modern man it was theorized this was the evolutionary process of humanity. The first of these large odd shaped skulls were found in the Neanderthal Valley and so were named the Neanderthal man. Several theories developed about the Neanderthal man, it was surmised by some as proof for the pre adamic race on this earth before Adam, while others surmised that we which they label, modern man evolved from him. There was no DNA technology at that time.
But recent DNA technology has proven that all who are alive on this earth today can trace their ancestry to the region of Africa and one woman…whom they fittingly call Eve as her name is defined as the mother of all. I find it hard to believe another race was on this planet with Adam and his descendants and God not stating so in the divine record of humanities beginnings.
We are aware of some sort of life having been on this earth in the first eon, as Peter speaks of two floods in the context of judgments rendered by God in his second letter. So it is the second eon that we read of God cleaning up the earth in preperation for Adam and Eve. In the beginning or a beginning of Genesis 1:1 speaks of the Universe while Verse 2 then turns to God causing the waters to dry up on the existing earth and preparing the earth for the creation of the human race with Adam as the patriarchal father…the earth was covered in water, a waste and void when God begins getting it ready for Adam and Eve. How could another race of beings be living on the earth if it was covered in water or, if God created another race before Adam and Eve the Bible tells us nothing about it and so we cannot enter it into our study of Genesis 6:1-4.
For any not familiar with the term, the eons, lets take a brief look at what this word the eons or ages is translated from whose meaning is also hidden from us in our modern English versions through faulty translation.
The understanding and information on the eons or ages has been lost due to the King James translation of the Hebrew word Olam and the Greek of Aion and Aionan, both are defined as pertaining to an indefinite period of time and has been wrongfully translated as eternal, forever, forever and ever and everlasting and even as world and worlds when the eternities would have sounded silly. The word eternity denotes no beginning and no end…only God fits that category…everything else in this Universe has had a beginning even time itself.
A good book which goes into depth on the mistranslation of the words Olam and Aionan which should be eon or age instead of eternity is Bob Evely’s book “At the end of the ages and the abolition of Hell.” He also has a website www.graceevangel.org. We have extra books or email him at email@example.com
For those not familiar with the use of the term, the eons in scripture and that Genesis 1,2 has more meaning than first meets the eye we should also briefly review this and first look at Isaiah 45:8 which tells us when God created the heavens and the earth….they were not originally in chaos or ruin. “For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God Himself that formed the earth and made it; He hath established it, He created it not in vain, He formed it to be inhabited; I am the LORD: and there is none else.”
The words not in vain in the Hebrew is tohu and in Genesis it was translated as without form. Meaning that the world was created not a waste or void and yet in the creation account at Genesis 1:2 it is said to be without form, void or waste, and covered in water. So this state of tohu… was not its origin…but it was the result of a first flooding of the earth due to some sort of chaos or rebellion.
When we go to 2 Peter 3:5-7 we can see that he speaks of two deluges. In Verse 5 speaks to the ancient world covered in water which is what we read about at Genesis 1:1 while at 2 Peter 3:7 speaks to the then world which would be of Noah time which perished also in water. So it seems Peter is speaking of the creation account we have in Genesis 1:1 which first states the absolute creation of the Universe and then Verse 2 begins with an already existing planet covered in water and the creative days describe the orderly process of God getting planet earth ready for our human parents Adam and Eve.
When we read 2 Peter 3:5-7 carefully we can see he refers to two worlds deluged by water, “heavens of old and an earth cohering out of water and through water” (1) The first eon, due to some sort of rebellion was deluged by God. (2) “by the word of God; through which the then world being deluged by water, perished.” These words are referring to the flood of Noah.
This is easily overlooked when reading through this passage as it can sound as though all of what Peter was saying refers only to the Noahic flood. So the point being in relation to Vladimir’s theory, if there was human life on this earth in the first eon…a pre Adamic race, they would have drowned…how could they be alive when God turns his attention to the ruined earth, described as void and waste and covered in water?
The Bible cannot be read like a novel. So the Genesis 1:2b,3 is then when God revisits the earth to clean it up, dry up the waters and begins getting it ready for Adam and Eve. Also this is made clear at Isaiah 45:18 which tells us that God originally created the world habitable. This is Genesis 1:1 and when first created it was not as it is described in Verse 2 as being, in ruin, or in chaos and void covered with water. So something happened after Verse 1 and before Verse 2 which caused the earth to become tohu, uninhabitable, a waste, void…covered in water
Then Verse 3 tells us that the Spirit of God was moving or vibrating, some say brooding over the surface of the waters…so the earth was covered in water. Were the Nephilim treading water waiting for eon two? This is followed by the words let it become light, night and day and then following this we are told that this was day one. So Verse 1 was speaking to the first eon or age before God begins cleaning up and preparing the earth for the creation of Adam.
That first eon is when the planet earth and the solar systems were first created and most likely where we would find the origin of the fossil remains of dinosaurs which perplex Bible students as to how old is this earth. That first eon, indeed could have been many, many, thousands of years long, making this earth much older than what we can account for when we go through the genealogy of humanity since Adams creation as given in the Biblical record.
In Genesis 1:2 God begins re-creating or cleaning up the chaos the earth was in, covered in water and we then can read forward into Verse 8 with what He does and this is said to be day one. Adam as the head of our human family is created on Day 6.
A couple more interesting passages are first Psalms 24: 1,2 “The earth is the LORD’S and the fullness thereof; The world, and they that dwell therein. For He hat founded it upon the seas, and established it upon the floods.” Also Psalms 136:5,6 “To Him that by wisdom made the heavens; For His mercy endures forever, To Him that stretched out the earth above the waters;” It seems the Bible writers understood far more about the worlds beginning and trials that we do.
So something happened between Verse 1 of Genesis which would have been in eon one and Verse 2, which is then eon two, the world was cleaned up, dried out and land appears and God makes it ready for our parents Adam and Eve to be created. We have no idea from scripture how long the first eon was or exactly what happened during it and why it was deluged by water.
We can estimate how long eon two was by the generations listed from Adam to Noah in Genesis and now being in Eon three which began after the flood and is still running till our present day, 2008, according to recorded history…approximately 4000 plus years and we are told the next eon will be 1000 years, we are given no estimate or idea of how long the last eon will be only that it will end with the salvation of all humanity and the reconciliation of the Universe. It will be the last eon as when all are reconciled time will no longer be an issue or needed.
A close examination of the account in Genesis compared with Peters words tell us the earth has been deluged two times with two coming judgments of fire. Water is symbolic of cleansing, fire symbolic of purification not eternal torment or eternal destruction. God is said to be a consuming fire if He is Love who of us would be afraid to be consumed by Him?
When knowing that the earth is far older that mans available recorded history it would indicate that there was some sort of life on this earth before the first deluge and helps to explain a lot that does not fit with a planet said by Christendom to be only 6000 years old.
And to then understand that our ancestors Adam and Eve were created in the second eon or age whose descendants have been on the already existing earth probably around 6000 years as most Bible Scholars estimate from recorded history and the Jewish record in the scriptures. With Peter indicating that there was a deluge which covered the earth with water before the Noahic flood and so that was the second time the world was deluged with water which brought to a close the second eon and the beginning of eon three.
As already said we are now living in eon three which began after the Noahic flood and will end when Christ arrives to set up His millennial kingdom and that will be eon four and the only eon we are told the length of…it is said to be 1000 years long, followed by eon five which is the day of God…the new heavens and new earth Revelation 21:1-4.
During those next two eons is when all humanity will come to salvation with the dead being raised out of the dust of the ground and all in the Universe to reconciliation with their creator. Daniel 12:2, John 5:29, Acts 24:15, Revelation 20:5,6
Understanding how the eons are periods of time and so we could use the more familiar term the ages with how we have no concept of how long the first eon or age was but only that the world was created quite some time before Adam and Eves creation and the history of our ancestors began.
This information is more in line with proven science and geological records of the earth’s strata layers and the fossils found in them which some are said to be much older than the 6000 years of our recorded history, fossils of animals such as the dinosaurs which are not in our world today. Some feel Job 40 and 41 are referring to dinosaurs but the geological evidence shows they were here before modern man as no significant fossil find them living at the same time.
Having a more correct knowledge of Genesis 1:1 speaking to the creation of the heavens and the earth and that time period or age would be the first eon gives far more time and credibility to the Biblical account and proven science being in agreement.
This knowledge of a previous eon and world deluged with water would have been known as Adam and his descendants were visited by angels who became their gods and shared information with them about the Universe and the earth and their knowledge and supernatural powers caused them to be worshipped as gods and this was the beginning of idolatry.
Also after the Noahic flood, humanity began to multiply again and we are told of Nimrod who defied the instructions from Jehovah, to scatter into all the earth, he instead built a city, having gathered much of humanity in that city and built the tower of Babel to use as an escape if God brought another flood. He also worshipped a false god and I would put forth this was not out of his imagination, but his interaction with more of Satan’s sinning messengers set upon deceiving humanity and thwarting Gods purpose and promise.
This is then when God confused the languages forcing humanity to move out and fill the earth, creating the nations of this world. Genesis 11:4-8 Even though these separated groups spoke new languages, they carried with them the information of the world before and after the flood, and of the gods they had worshipped and so these became the legends of their ancestors taken to different parts of the world and that is why the same basic stories are found in every country and culture of the world yet today.
So too briefly sum up Vladimir’s teaching….he rejected the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 and put forth several alternative viewpoints. One being, that the Nephilim were a pre adamic race and that Adam and Eve did not have daughters for a long time…..also he leaned towards the Sethite viewpoint, which is that the sons of God of Genesis 6:1 were the sons of Seth who married either Adams original daughters or Cain’s and that was the sin that brought about the flood…He gives no scriptural proof for any of these theories………because there are none.
A. E. Knoch’s viewpoint
Knoch’s article on Genesis 6 is from Volume 22, The Unsearchable Riches, Pages 371-383.
He wrote this on the Nephilim in 1931. It was in answer to readers who had read the series of articles by Vladimir Gelesnoff but before it was finished he died. In his article Knoch stated that he could not agree with much of what Vladimir wrote in his earlier articles on this subject although Knoch also did not accept the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 and he too it seems accepted the Sethite view.
That must be why Knoch translated Genesis 6:1-4 markedly different, as he did not capitalize Alueim for the creator but chose to use, alueim meaning the leaders of chiefs of men in Verse 2. Yes Alueim is a title and as such can also be applied to the leaders of men but was it correct to apply it to men in Genesis 6:2?
Also in Verse 4 he translated, giants, or Nephilim as the distinguished. So even though we have already talked about it some we are going to look at his viewpoint again and see what proofs or reasons he gave for his translation choices and why he too accepted the Sethite view.
Let’s look again at how Genesis 6:1-4 is translated in the Concordant Literal Version.
Genesis 6:1-4 CLV; 1. “And coming is it that humanity starts to be multitudinous on the surface of the ground, and daughters are born to them.
2. And seeing are the sons of the alueim the daughters of the human, that they are good, and taking are they for themselves wives of all whom they choose.”
3. And saying is Ieue Alueim, Not abide shall My spirit in the human for the eon, in that moreover he is flesh. And come shall his days to be a hundred and twenty years.
4. Now the distinguished come to be in the earth in those days, and, moreover, afterward, coming are those who are sons of the alueim to the daughters of the human, and they bear for them. They are the masters, who are from the eon, mortals with the name.”
The Concordant Version is translated…sons of the alueim and daughters of the human and that even with Knoch’s view that these sons were men, this translation still shows some sort of distinction was being made….between the sons and the daughters.
If the sons were humans, men, the leaders or chiefs of that era and yet were Adams descendants as were the daughters why would Holy Spirit interject a new use of alueim without an explanation or any details given that would explain that these sons of the alueim were leaders or rulers of men and why were no names given of who these men were or exactly what they did beside taking wives? Nothing new with taking wives that had been going on for hundreds of years?
Also, I have another question, where is the rule of two witnesses, which ties to how a word is understood by how it was first used in the Hebrew language and establishes its meaning and governs how it used after that? From Genesis 1:1 through to Genesis 6, Alueim or Elohim was consistently used in relation to GOD as the creator.
The Jewish Study Bible translated this passage as, “When men began to increase on earth and daughters were born to them, the divine beings saw how beautiful the daughters of men were and took wives from among those that pleased them.”
In the notes the translator states “that the Nephilim of Israelite tradition were preternatural giants that once dwelt in the land…Numbers 13:31-33” The commentator is linking Genesis 6 with Numbers 13 which records when Israel was at the border of the land of Canaan and before entering in they sent spies in to assess the enemies Jehovah told them they were to either kill or run out of the land and they came back “fearful because of the men of great stature as the sons of Anak which come of the giants and we were as grasshoppers in their sight.”
Bullinger refers to this incident as the second irruption of the giants or the Nephilim in Numbers and Deuteronomy we will read that they were huge and fearful to the Israelites linked to what is said in Genesis 6: 4 “As for the Nephilim, giants or distinguished they were on earth in those days and also after that or afterward when the sons of God or sons of elohim went into the daughters…..” The writer alluding to what went on before the flood and also after the flood….Bullinger describes as the second irruption.
Bullinger’s notes in the Companion Bible point to the word giants translated from the Hebrew name Nephilim and this passage in Numbers as the second irruption of these giants or Nephilim.
The CLV says, “There we saw the distinguished (the sons of Anak are part of the distinguished ones) and we became in our own eyes, like grasshoppers; so we became in their eyes.”
I would like to point out what seems to be to be a flaw in the Concordant Version, with Knoch’s explanation of Genesis 6:4 as explained in the Concordant Pentateuch footnotes which said the distinguished were the Sethite arbitrators or leaders….how pray tell are the sons of Anak the Sethite arbitrators of Genesis 6 who lived before the flood the same as those talked about in Numbers 13:33 centuries later.
There are no footnotes in the older CLV or the new Pentateuch CLV to explain why the use of distinguished in the Numbers account where it said earlier this name applied to the firstborn sons of Seth which would not apply after the flood centuries later in Numbers. But let’s keep this in mind as we will look again at the footnotes on Genesis 6:4 again when we discuss Verse 4 in the CLV in more depth.
In Genesis 6:1-4 I have underlined the different statements that we are investigating, let’s again compare the KJAV with the CLV
1. “And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them.
2. That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair: and they took them wives of all which they chose.”
3. “And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.”
4. “And there were giants in the earth in those days: and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, The same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”
There are several things we are going to discuss that are said in Genesis 6:1-4 and so we will go through these four verses in both translations and try and build a case for which view is true. Let’s begin with,
Verse 1 “When men began to multiply and daughters were born to them.” KJAV
Genesis 6:1 it tells us the daughters of men were daughters of ha adam and all three men, Vladimir, Knoch, Bullinger agreed this was in reference to the man Adam.
In the passage at Genesis 6:1 the Concordant Literal Version; “humanity starts to be multitudinous”
In Bullinger’s notes in The Companion Bible, he said that the literal Hebrew reads “when ha-adam began to multiply and that, ha adam in the Hebrew is “the man Adam” and so would read, when Adam began to multiply. In that case then Genesis 6:1-4 has gone back to Adams time…
Bullinger’s notes also explain, the Hebrew words used for man or men; Ha’adham is the man Adam and H’-adamah is for the ground…which denotes his origin as being made from the dust or soil of the Adamah. Ish has regards to the male sex, a male. Enosh in regards to his infirmities, as physically and or of being mortal also it is used in relation to character and incurable. Geber is used in respect to strength, of a mighty man.
The account in Chapter Six could be going back in time and referring to Adam and Eve began having sons and daughters or it could be referring to all the daughters born to Adam and to his sons and daughters and their sons and daughters up to the time of Noah because Adam was the Patriarchal father of the human race. I have read that there is no word in the Hebrew for grandfather or great grandfather. I feel it is not important as to what son these daughters may have been from as if so, wouldn’t God have specifically stated it?
So, the term given of the daughters of the man Adam could be specific and going back to Adam and the beginning of the multiplying of the human race which these three men believed the daughters were Adams directly. Bullinger and Knoch felt Chapter Six goes back in time to the beginning of Adam and Eve bearing children but Vladimir’s view was that, no daughters were born to Adam until Chapter Six
Thus to follow the context if Verse 1 is speaking of Adam and he is the subject then in the rest of the sentence when it says, and daughters were born to them, the them would be Adam and Eve and would not be speaking of humanity in general…..but referring to…the daughters born to Adam and Eve.
I found in the articles written by A.E. Knoch, and Vladimir Gelesnoff and Alexander Thomson that they agreed with what Dr. Bullinger wrote on the word “ha-adam” and that it does mean, the man or the man, Adam and so that passage should read the daughters of the man or the daughters of Adam. But it still could apply with him as the Patriarchal father to all.
Yet Knoch did not clarify that in his translation at Verse 1 as he translated it as “And coming is it that humanity starts to be multitudinous on the surface of the ground, and daughters are born to them.” I do not understand why the Concordant translates…ha-adam as humanity in Verse 1 as ha-adam is quite different from the word anthropas which is where we get the word, humanity and then in Verse 2 it has the daughters of the human…same word according to Bullinger’s notes, unless of course Knoch was viewing Adam as the Patriarchal Father.
So Verse 2 is in relation to it being Adam who was being spoken of in the context as the CLV reads at “And seeing are the sons of the alueim the daughters of the human, that they are good, and taking are they for themselves wives of all whom they choose.” So in Verse 1 he applied it to humanity and in Verse 2 to the human….one man, Adam.
In Knoch’s article he agrees that the genealogy accounts going back in time at Chapter 6. So in Chapter Five we read of Adams sons and of Seth’s birth which was about 130 years after Cain was banished to the land of Nod. The genealogy gives the line of men coming from Adam to Seth and from Seth to Noah and then Chapter Six goes back in time to Adams days with the beginning of the multiplying of humanity with its purpose to speak of the daughters of Adam of which Verse 2 said the sons of the Alueim or alueim took for wives
This is clear when correctly translated from the Hebrew and the passage reads as, “the sons of God (Alueim or alueim) seeing the daughters of Adam (the man, ha-adham) were fair and taking as wives all that they choose.”
We are not told of daughters by name in the early account, or of other sons but only of Cain and Able and then no other sons or daughters are named until Seth. I might add here that some feel Cain and Able were twins as the account does not say Adam knew Eve and begat Able as it did with Cain and later with Seth) Then the account jumps forward about 100 years to Seth as it state Adam is 130 when he begets Seth, so would this mean Adam and Eve had no other children until Seth?
This does not make sense as they must have had daughters as Cain left that area and we read he settles in Nod and has a wife. The scanty account is what gives fuel to the pre adamic race. God gave the basic facts concerning the key players whose lives were important as they led to Noah and the flood from there to Abram and to the nation of Israel and to Jesus Christ……the promised seed of Genesis 3:15
In the meantime Cain is said to have married and having sons as his genealogy is also given in Chapter 4:17-24. But if we are only given a general account, of the key players leading to Noah and since Cain married a sister or a daughter of one of his brothers, daughters had to of been born to Adam and Eve early on and this then could indicate the Alueim or leaders of men began marrying early on as is spoken of in Genesis 6:2
We have to remember the premise behind Vladimir’s rejection of the literal viewpoint and believing instead of the pre adamic race and also the Sethite theory developed in the 3rd to 5th century and Knoch seems to have accepted the Sethite theory also. But I still feel if these sons of the alueim were Seth’s sons the account would have said so and if the sin was intermarriage between Cain and Seth’s line the account would have said so.
While the literal view is the sons of the Alueim were the sinning messengers both Peter and Jude spoke of being locked away in the time of the flood and for doing something very bad. This would mean these sons of God early on left their own habitation and took mortal women for wives. But we will go through this in more depth when we get to the review of Bullinger’s research.
Now remember Vladimir stated that Adam and Eve did not have daughters for a long time, only sons? Again he gave no scriptural proof for why he said that. As said earlier Vladimir believed in the pre-Adamic race and so that is where he would assume Cain found a wife… Vladimir’s emphasis was on the point he felt important and that was that the daughters of Adam were not spoken of until Genesis 6 which makes me think he was reading the Bible like a novel and he did not see as Bullinger and Knoch both pointed out, Chapter Six goes back in time to Adam and the start of the multiplying of humanity..
According to the articles Knoch wrote, he did not agree with the Pre adamic race and said it was not a correct view as there was no scriptural proof. I feel he was correct as we are told, Eve was the mother of all…(but some will say that meant living after her) Genesis 3:20 and so we then go to what Paul states, that all nations came from the one….man, Adam in Acts 17:26
But some will also say the other races died in the flood. But if there were other races would not anyone in the Bible have told us about them? The teaching of other races on this earth at the same time of Adam’s creation is borrowed from paganism and their experiences with the fallen messengers who appeared with the human form and of course with powers that humans did not have and so were worshipped as gods.
For me, it would seem reasonable that Adam and Eve being two very healthy and strong people and with no birth control pills would have been quite capable of producing a child every year for a couple hundred years or more….and so there would be…lots of kids, girls and boys! Adam lived to be 930 years old and we are not told but he may have even taken other wives? But in the natural progression it is likely that their children could have been marrying every 20 years or so although some verses say at age 65 this one begat so and so but the point being there would have been lots of procreating, producing, lots of sons and daughters.
The Jewish Study Bible translated Verse 1,2 as “When men began to increase on the earth and daughters were born to them, the divine beings saw how beautiful the daughters of men were and took wives from among those that pleased them.” In their notes it is said “this myth was well known in the Mesopotamian regions but explains why humans no longer attain the high ages of those before the flood. Also it explains the origin of the Nephilim in Verse 4, the preternatural giants that Israelite tradition thought once dwelt in the land. Numbers 13:31-33.
Also the Jewish commentator points to Gods creation account and how that He pronounced each day that everything He made was good including man….and yet in this passage God is…saddened at the wickedness on the earth.”
I find this word saddened more understandable that the usual translation, of repenting or regretting of having made man.
Why, do I say this, because if we believe God is in control and has always been in control, then why would anything humanity have done in sin been a surprise to Him and warranted the severe judgment of a worldwide flood? But I can see how, God would be saddened for humanity, especially so, if the literal view is true that Satan sent his seed by means of the sinning messengers into humanity to corrupt Adams lineage and prevent the fulfillment of Genesis 3:15 which warned him Eve’s seed would crush his head.
Continuing on with Genesis 6:2, As we have seen, Knoch chose to translate the sons of God differently from the KJAV and all others translations, which have the Alueim being the Creator, instead he renders it, “and seeing are the sons of the alueim the daughters of the human.”
Now normally I appreciate the Concordant Translation as it is more accurate that most translation, but in this instance I was surprised by how Knoch translated these four verses and especially in regards to the sons of the alueim and so wanted to know what his reasons were for doing so.
Knoch did translate this passage to agree with the Hebrew language which differentiates between the daughters of the human and the sons of the alueim, even though he does not capitalize alueim indicating his belief that these sons were not the sons of God the Creator but instead the sons of the leaders of men, specifically the firstborn sons of Seth. The point being a contrast was made in this passage by Holy Spirit between the sons and the daughters…and so we need to ask why?
I have searched for any proofs that Knoch might give for deciding this was to speaking about sons of God but of sons of men and found none….I looked for proofs that this applied to Seth’s sons and found none. As I said earlier I am confused as to why Knoch believed this was speaking of men and not of the Creator as every passage before it used Elohim or Alueim in relation to God, nowhere before Genesis 6 are men given then term? Much later in scripture we will find it applied to leaders but not in Genesis.
If this was referring to Seth’s first born sons why did it not simply read sons of ha-adham, as sons of Adam…..if these were men the same as the daughters of ha-adham? Or why not follow the usual pattern…so and so begat so and so. There is a marked difference with this passage. If these sons were humans they would also be the sons of the man Adam as the patriarchal father or if these were the sons of Seth why not say so and if these men were some sort of rulers, arbitrators or leaders of that day why is not more told us about them in that capacity? It seems to me to be a sudden interjecting of a new title for men without explaining why? And also none of the men listed in Genesis up to this point have been called the chiefs, leaders or sons of God?
I can find nothing in the chapters leading up to this one or in it to indicate what is said in the footnotes of the Concordant Pentateuch, Page 18 or anything that hints at it, but this is what it says, (Genesis 6:2 elohim; arbiters or judges (as in Exodus 21:6) here the firstborn sons named in 5:6-3) So, I thought the principle in the study of the scriptures as is given by Knoch in other article he wrote was that we should go back to the first use of a word in the Hebrew language for the interpretation and not forward in time…to Exodus? If this passage is referring to the firstborn sons of Seth why wouldn’t the account in Genesis just say so?
The footnotes in the CLV Pentateuch at Genesis 6:4 says “the distinguished, Mortals of renown: firstborn sons in the line of Seth who had wedded Adams daughters so as to strengthen their positions as arbiters.) Several things bother me about this comment, the first born sons in the line of Seth, had wedded Adams daughters are the distinguished? The scripture indicates the name Nephilim, translated as giants in the KJAV of which Knoch translates as distinguished were the offspring of the marriage union of the sons of God and the mortal women…of which Knoch had said the alueim were the first born sons of Seth and so that confuses me….as it seems he makes both the distinguished?
Is he saying the sons of the alueim are also the distinguished? I find this confusing and unfortunately he does not clear it up but it seems to me to read that the distinguished were the offspring or the children of the sons of the alueim…going with Knoch’s translation..
Several things are said differently in this 6th chapter from the preceding chapters which indicates some things are different. One thing, in all other accounts, we read of Adam, Cain or Seth and others as, “knowing their wife and begetting sons and daughters” while in this account in Genesis 6 we do not see the usual language, instead it says, “the sons of the alueim or Alueim saw that the daughters were fair or good looking and taking of all they chose and bearing are they to them offspring or children”
No begetting of sons and daughters…but another new term, the bearing of offspring or children. So these things which are different from the preceding chapters should cause us to have questions. Also these offspring are all said to be male, men; as the mighty men of renown.
Knoch’s rendering of Genesis 6:2 shows his belief that the sons were of the alueim or elohim as leaders of men and not God. But in this verse I would like to know what evidence Knoch found and based his assumptions on for speaking about the leaders of men and not of the Creator other than perhaps his pre conceived acceptance of the Sethite theory? Did this cloud his translation? Or am I too stupid to figure this out?
Knoch gave no explanation in his article other than he preferred the spelling of nph as nphil as he said it could go either way, nphal for fallen ones or nphil for distinguish and distinguished fit nicely. So I have to say it fit nicely with his preconceived Sethite view of these sons, being arbitrators or leaders. Also in the new Concordant Pentateuch, the editors do not give any further proof, just their statement in the footnotes on Page 18, of “the distinguished being the Sethite leaders of that time…referring to the genealogy of Seth” which in the scriptural account nothing is said about any men being leaders or arbitrators?
Why did Knoch see fit to interject a new use of Alueim, as alueim for the leaders of men with no names given of these leaders and this seems especially important because in all the preceding passages where Alueim or Elohim is used it refers to the Creator not once do we find a reference to men being alueim in Genesis. It is not until after the flood and when the nation of Israel is formed and leaders are appointed that we find alueim used in that way and it is very clear in the context as to why.
In the previous genealogy the names of the men were given, Adams sons and his sons and so why not name these men if they were the leaders and arbitrators of that time in Chapter 6. If these were men and they were the leaders of the time or if they were breaking a command from God, not to marry a certain line certainly these things would have been put in the record, and since it is not, I feel that the conclusions drawn by both Vladimir and Knoch are speculation.
Vladimir’s theories were not his own invention; they are found in the roots of the Sethite theory begun in the 3rd through the 5th centuries accepted and made popular by the Catholic Church and Augustine. I feel Knoch must have also followed along with the Sethite theory which is unprovable in scripture and yet those following Knoch today are also accepting it because he did. Or is it my lack of understanding for where or what he bases his belief and his translation of alueim, but he really does not explain it and I need more information in order to form a conclusion if his translation of this word has merit.
The sons of the Alueim as the Creator or should it be the sons of the leaders of men?
So to review Knoch’s viewpoint, he did not accept the literal view that angels married mortal women and produced offspring or children which are who is being referred to by the name, the Nephilim. Knoch’s argument first was simply to state the Sethite view and then when I noticed how he translated this passage I looked for his reasons…but found none other than he had accepted the Sethite view.
Secondly Knoch put forth his argument that the alueim were the sons of men but he also said, that even if this passage was referring to the sons of God it was still referring to the sons being men as angels were not the only ones said to be sons of God in the Old Testament and then he used Luke 3:38 as his proof text. ?
Let look at Luke 3:38 this is where we read, Adam is said to be Gods son and so Knoch said this proved men were the sons of God. He did not bring out all the other scriptures that we are going to look at in reference to who it is said are the sons of God in the Old Testament versus those who are said to be sons in the New Testament. This too disappointed me as he did not present all the information available in the scriptures and I do believe he knew better than that…but was he simply, stuck on the Sethite View?
We are now going to look through God’s Word and see if we can discern who are the sons of God and when, and why or how humans are said to be the sons of God and when they are not, in order to help us establish who these “sons” spoken of in Genesis 6 were and this will be the first step in understanding who their offspring were.
There are four other references to the sons of God in the Old Testament and they always refer to angels.
Let’s look at the other scriptural examples which use the same term found in Genesis 6, the sons of God. Job 1:6 “Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.”
Job 2:1 “Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD.”
Let’s also read Job 38:7 “When the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy.” Also Daniel 3:25 ..it was put forth in one article that I read that Jesus was not yet born as the Son of God and so the fourth person in the fiery furnace may have been an angelic son of God protecting the three boys.
The same Hebrew term is used in these four passages as was used in Genesis 6 and no one would even consider that the other passages were not talking of any other beings, than angels or messengers and so Bullinger asks the question, why should we choose to believe it is any different in Genesis 6?
Let’s compare the two views again, the phrase “the sons of God” in the KJAV and Bullinger saying in the Hebrew it reads, sons of the ha-Elohim, or Alueim and literally means the sons of the Creator as that has been its usage from Genesis 1:1. While those who accepted the Sethite theory of Genesis 6 say this is speaking about the sons as men as Adams descendants…or more specific the sons of Seth and were the rulers and or leaders of that time supposed to be the righteous line of Seth. I keep comparing these views in order for us to see which seems most plausible and supported by scripture.
The sons of God
In Appendix 23, of The Companion Bible, Bullinger points out, “It is only by the Divine specific act of creation that any created being can be called ‘a son of God’ For that which is “born of the flesh is flesh and that born of spirit is spirit?” John 3:6 “Adam is called a “son of God” in Luke 3:38 as he was a direct creation.”
Bullinger also points out “This is why angels are called sons of God in every other place where the expression is used in the Old Testament. (Ha-Elohim) Such as, Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7 Psalms 29:1; 89:6; and Daniel 3:25 We have no authority or right to take the expression in Genesis 6:2, 4 in any other sense.”
Chuck Missler also has a series of articles on this subject of Genesis 6:1-4 and he accepts the literal viewpoint as did Bullinger and this is what his research shows on “the term, translated ‘the sons of God’ in the Hebrew, B’nai HaElohim, Sons of Elohim, which is a term consistently used in the Old Testament for angels, and it is never used of believers in the Old Testament. It was so understood by the ancient rabbinical sources, by the Septuagint translators in the 3rd century, before Christ, and by the early church fathers. Attempts to apply this term to “godly leadership” are without Scriptural foundation.”
He also points to what Scofield had to say in his translation. Scofield also did not accept the literal view and I have noticed in his comments in is translation, he very much leaned toward the spiritualizing view of scripture. And so Scofield in his argument against the literal view rejecting Bullinger’s information that the humans of that time would not be said to be sons of God and Scofield pointed to “Isaiah 43:6 as he wrote
“In that passage we find it referring to Israel as “my sons and my daughters” as proof that term was not only for angels” But Missler pointed out in his article why he felt that Scofield was not correct, Missler writes “What is said in Isaiah is not the same term used in the 4 places where the term, sons of God are found and all which reference angelic beings.”
I would also first that Israel as a nation is spoken of as a son, in that nation was created by Jehovah. I will also add, by looking at the passage in Isaiah 43:6 in Scofield’s Bible, I notice he placed his heading of what was being talked of in each chapter and in this chapter he has, “Israel’s redemption and restoration” In reading that chapter we see that it is speaking to a time when Jehovah will call His People from all corners of the earth and it also speaks of a gathering of the nations…which sounds to me, to be applicable after Christ returns, with the gathering of the nations at the Glory throne judgment of Matthew 25:31.
So the point being that this verse in Isaiah given by Scofield is in relation to Israel and appears to be for the future, a time when those of Israel will no longer be children but by means of His Spirit, and the new covenant, will have matured into, sons of God. The saints of Israel in the New Testament are said to be His children while it is only Paul who refers to the saints in the new administration as sons of God as Paul says by means of adoption and being a new creation…we will look at those verses further on.
I would remind us that it is said in the historical accounts that no where before the 5th century A.D. was there an interpretation for “the sons of God” other than that of it referring to angels. But let’s do more study of when, and how the term is used the sons of God. Now we will look at how are Israel and then the Body of Christ spoken of as being sons of God or as children of God in which neither would apply to the immoral descendants of Adam.
The nation of Israel, chosen by Jehovah, was said to be My son and applied as a type to Jesus Christ. Exodus 4:22 “My son, My firstborn is Israel” Bullinger links this passage to Matthew 2:15 as it is quoted there in reference to Jesus being called out of Egypt as My son when he was a babe.
This verse is again repeated at Hosea 11:1-4 “When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called My son out of Egypt” and referenced by Paul in Romans 9:1-4 “The truth am I telling in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience testifying together with me in His spirit, that my sorrow is great, and unintermittent pain is in my heart….for I myself wished to be anathema from Christ for my brethren, my relatives according to the flesh, who are Israelites, whose is the sonship and the glory and the covenants and the legislation and the divine service and the promises: whose are the fathers and out of whom is the Christ according to the flesh, Who is over all, God be blessed for the eons, Amen!”
Israel was chosen to become a nation, a peculiar people. Deuteronomy 14:2 and 26:18 A chosen nation given birth to by being brought through the Red Sea by Jehovah and then placed into a covenant relationship with Him as His People and they were to be His servant and His witnesses. This relationship is quite unique and different from the rest of the world of mankind who are said to be “without God, as His enemies and without hope in the world.” Ephesians 2:12 So Israel the nation was said to be a son, a servant, a witness and a wife to Jehovah. The nation was formed hundred of years after the flood.
Let’s look at Paul’s writings on the term, Sons of God in the New Testament
Those called into the Body of Christ are said to be a new creation, 2 Corinthians 5:17 and are called “sons of God” at Ephesians 2:10 Paul also tells us this at Romans 8:14, 15 “For whoever are being led by Gods spirit, these are sons of God. For you did not get slavery’s spirit to fear again, but you got the spirit of sonship, in which we are crying Abba, Father! The spirit itself is testifying together with our spirit that we are children of God.”
When we consider the differences with our evangel from Israel’s evangel this use of the sons of God is understandable, Paul told us we are adopted…chosen for the place of a son. Galatians 4:5 Ephesians 1:5 Romans 8:15, 23 We are chosen in grace, justified in the flesh, seated with Christ in the heavenlies These spiritual allotments tell us that our placement as sons is secure. Paul explains the sonship of Israelites in covenant relationship with Jehovah at Romans 9:1-5 The new covenant will give Israel sonship under Christ.
It is Paul who speaks of the believer as a son. Neither, Peter, James nor John uses the Greek word, huios, for son, of a believer…that seems to be the exclusive to the Apostle Paul’s evangel. Those distinguished ones of Genesis 6….led the world into wickedness and were not led by Gods Spirit….or else they would not have been judged and perished in the flood of Noah.
So in the past those who were faithful and those called out of the nation of Israel, have the hope to be in the kingdom on earth with their messiah, and their hope is based on the requirement of their own faithfulness…thus the passage at Hosea 1:10 foretells in the Messianic kingdom of Christ, that through their regeneration they shall be sons of God” this is their promise…the hope of Israel for the future.
The apostle John also said this at 1 John 5:4 “for all that is begotten of God is conquering the world. And this is the conquest that conquers the world: our faith.” Notice the differences; we in the new administration are given a measure of faith, Romans 12:3b.
While John was speaking to those in the bride church when he said, it is our faith that conquers…that faith consisted of their acceptance and continued belief that Jesus Christ was their messiah and the Son of God. In the letters for this bride church they are spoken of as children of God and not sons…that comes later…to those who have conquered…they could and many did, fall away.
Paul tells us that those called into the Body of Christ are given sonship by means of adoption and as such the placement or status as a son is given based on Christ’s faithfulness and not on our own, this is just one of the many spiritual blessings we are graced with in spirit…. now. Ephesians 1:3. So lets keep looking at how children versus sons is used in the scriptures to aid us in understanding the use of the term, the sons of God in Genesis 6;1-4
Children versus Sons
There are several places in the KJAV which have been translated wrongly, speaking of those of Israel coming to Christ as being sons of God, while in the Concordant Literal Version we see that they are translated as children of God and Bullinger’s notes in the Companion Bible, shows he agreed. He explains that in these passages the word is teknon plural for children in the Greek, and is not the word huios for son.
The Greek word for son is Huio’s. So Knoch and Bullinger both agreed on the this. Two important passages which should read children of God instead of sons of God are, John 1:13, 1 John 3:1,
John 1:13 “Yet whoever obtained Him, to them He gives the right to become children of God, to those who are believing in His name, who were begotten, not of blood, neither of the will of the flesh, neither of the will of a man, but of God.” John also reaffirms this for those in the bride Church at 1 John 3:1 “Perceive what manner of love the Father has given us, that we may be called children of God! And we are!
Also there is one passage which has done the reverse and this is Galatians 3:7, 26 in the KJAV it reads, children of Abraham and the Concordant Literal Version, correctly has the sons of Abraham. Bullinger makes a note in the margin…the word is huios…which is son and not children.
In this passage Paul was speaking of those, of faith and by faith as these are the sons of Abraham, spiritually. Those of us called into the Body of Christ from the Gentile nations are not physical descendants of Abraham and yet because we are of the faith of Jesus Christ and by this we are declared righteous by the God of Abraham and thus he is our father spiritually.
The point being we have been placed in Christ given His righteousness and I believe the measure of faith we are given is a measure of His faith…by the use of this term, the faith of Jesus Christ. The preposition of denoting it is His faith and not our own that we are a part of. Romans 12:3b. We are said to be His complement, His body and He as our Head, placing us in Him as the seed promised in Genesis 3:15.
What is Christ’s is ours as His body, the Body of Christ is to occupy the celestial realm for the purpose of conciliating the spirit beings which live in that realm to God while on the earth the promise was given to Abraham, first through his seed that a great nation would come and from that nation would come Jesus Christ, the seed promised to redeem humanity from Sin and Death and crush the head of the adversary, Satan! Paul also tells us that Christ heads up both these administrations, Ephesian 1:9,10
Paul says we are said to be His sons…of faith….and also as Paul tells us, we have been adopted into Gods family of faith and given the place of sons. So this means we have been begotten of the spirit, removed from Adams lineage and placed in Christ’s. This process is done by God for those He has chosen for the new administration and thus who are a new creation.
Christ paid the price for this process to also be given the rest of humanity in God’s due season. 1 Timothy 2:5,6 “For there is one God, and one Mediator of God and mankind a Man, Christ Jesus, Who is giving Himself a correspondent Ransom for all, the testimony (of this will be made apparent ) in it own eras,”
The era of the New Administration began with Paul and will continue until the Body of Christ is “snatched away to meet the Lord in the air” 1 Thessalonians 4: 13-18 In the meantime this administration stands alone in grace and alone in reconciliation and alone in the adoption as sons of God….by means of His spirit dwelling within, as a firstfruit of these things we are a new creation and as His temple today are qualified through Christ to be called the sons of God. Romans 8:9-25
I found a short paper done by Charles H. Welch listing the different words used in the KJAV for children and sons and like terms used in the scriptures which hopefully will help clarify this even more…I will put his article here for your consideration.
Children vs. Sons By Charles H. Welch
Several Greek words are translated ‘children’ in the A.V. New Testament.
Brephos, a new-born babe, Acts 7:19.
Nepios, an infant not having the power of speech (Gal. 4:3; Eph. 4:14).
Paidion a little or young lad (Matt. 14:21).
Paidarion a very little lad (Matt. 11:16).
Pais a lad, boy, servant or maid (Matt. 2:16).
Teknon a child, one that has been born a child whether son or daughter (Matt. 2:18).
Huios, a son, a male (Matt. 5:9).
“The two words with which we are here particularly concerned with are teknon and huios. Unfortunately the KJAV has not been quite consistent in their rendering giving us ‘child’ in seventy-seven occurrences and ‘son’ in twenty-one, as translations of teknon, and translating huiosas ‘child’ fifty times, ‘son’ 120, ‘Son’ 210 times.”
“It is evident from this survey, that teknon means ‘a child’ as distinct from huios which means ‘a son’, but there are passages where this distinction should have been made clear where precision is dulled by the translator. For example where John 1:12 reads ‘gave them power to become sons of God’ it should read ‘children’ So also that well-known passage in 1 John 3:1,2, ‘that we should be called the sons of God’, ‘now are we the sons of God’ must be altered to read ‘children of God’. John uses the word huios twenty four times, but never of a believer.”
”It is Paul whose ministry speaks of the believer as a ‘son’ (Romans 8:14,19), and the reader should remember when reading Galatians 3:7,26 to translate ‘sons’ there also. John’s ministry brings the believer into the family of faith; Paul takes the saints called by his evangel further and gives the position of a son.”
“So Israel as compared with the nations have the place of ‘sons’ as Jehovah created them into a nation, although the phrase ‘the children of Israel’ has become so commonly used that we do not suggest that we should attempt to alter it, only that we should remember, that where the A.V. reads ‘children of Israel’ the Greek uses the word huios ‘son’, remembering the inspired consequence ‘if a son, then an heir of God’.
“It should also be remembered that all ‘sons’ must be ‘children’, but that all children need not necessarily be sons. Neither Peter, James nor John uses the word huios of a believer, that is the exclusive testimony of the ministry entrusted to Paul.” by Charles Welch
So the point being in going back to our original passage of Genesis 6:1-4 in relation to the question, who are the sons of God being spoken of in Verse 2, the abundance of scriptures seems to give the answer that not all of mankind is qualified to be called the sons of God. Adam qualified because he was a direct creation and so that is the principal for those who are directly created by God…which includes those in celestial realms as the messengers or angels are direct creations of God and thus are called the sons of God.
In the New Testament, we read what qualifies a human to be called a son and that was something done by the spirit of God as a direct creation like Adam or for those whom God chooses and places in the new administration as a new creation and are also said to be the firstfruit of the spirit by Paul, receiving the adoption as sons. These ones are those in the Body of Christ as the new administration of Grace that fit the criteria of what it takes to be called a son of God.
In the Old Testament, this term was used only for Adam and the angelic creation and in relation to Israel the nation as Jehovah created Israel to be a chosen nation and while in covenant relationship with Jehovah, Israel was said by Moses, “Sons are you to Jehovah your Elohim” at Deuteronomy 14:1.
Literally this is saying, you are sons to Jehovah your creator, but of them as a nation, the passage continues with instructions on how they are not to copy the nations around them and reminding them that, they were chosen to be a holy nation for Jehovah, which as we know Israel lost that right, or designation and thus lost the honor and religious privilege to be the witnesses of Jehovah for turning to idolatry and thus were declared, lo ammi, meaning not My People.
So, according to Israel’s apostle John spirit begets spirit and flesh begets flesh. Adams begotten by spirit as a direct creation is rightfully said to be a son of God while his descendants could not be called the sons of God as they were begotten of flesh procreated out of Adam’s union with Eve, in sin. The spirit world does not procreate in heaven and as such they are direct creations of God the spirit. John 3:6
In the Apostle John’s letters, he said he and those in the bride church were, children of God perhaps this is because they could fall away and lose out on their hope of ruling in the kingdom with Christ? But those in the new administration are secure in their calling because its home law is grace. Paul said, we, who are chosen in Grace and are placed in Christ by God the spirit are given faith, we are of the faith of Jesus Christ and because of that have been declared righteous and justified now while in the flesh, and through the adoption are the sons of God as we are a new creation and the firstfruit of the spirit….under no condemnation. Romans 8:1
The Jews called into the bride Church during the ministry of Jesus and later added to by the ministry of the twelve appointed apostles, are not called sons but children of God being brought into the family of faith and so it would seem that the prophecy in Isaiah 43 that Scofield used as his proof text would have reference to Israel the nation and not individuals and will be fulfilled in the Messianic kingdom through the new covenant and that is when those of Israel will be also a new creation brought out of death by the Spirit of God and thus will be the sons of God.
About seven years after the death of Jesus, came the calling of Saul of Tarsus and years later after his severing he becomes the apostle Paul, Acts 13:1-3,9: 14:14. Paul began taking his evangel to the nations, calling out those chosen for the Body of Christ. Through Paul’s evangel based on the secret hidden in God for the eons God implemented a new administration in which….all are chosen by Him in Grace and given His Spirit and placed in Christ. Ephesians 1:3 Colossians 1:26.
Those who are called into the Body of Christ are removed from Adams lineage and placed in Christ’s lineage and given His allotment as a Son and that is the adoption we experience which places us in the place of a son. Romans 8:15,23 Galatians 4:6,7 Ephesians 1:5 This is done by Gods spirit as the flesh is dead in Christ.
We are sealed which signifies security in our calling and placement in the body, also given the earnest of the spirit which is the guarantee that all that has been promised to those chosen through Paul’s evangel will be received by them as they are hidden with Christ in God. Colossians 3:3
So getting back to the subject of this article for these reason I do not accept Scofield reasoning or that of Knoch with his quoting Luke 1:23 in regard to anyone but Adam in the Old Testament qualified to be a son of God. And so at this point in my mind at least I have discounted Knoch’s translation of alueim in Genesis 6:2 as being the sons of Seth and the leaders of men at that time and for me, this information proves, that the sons of God also in Genesis 6:2 could not be of mankind as only Adam was a direct creation and so that leaves the angels or messengers…who as Jude 6 said, left their own estate or habitation.
I am sorry that I cannot agree with A. E. Knoch in this particular article as I feel he should have presented all this information we have looked at just now on the sons of God instead of merely pointing to Luke 3:38 as his proof text. But I wonder if this isn’t an example of how if we have a preconceived belief and feel there is no need to keep looking into all the facts or information from others on an opposing view. We are all subject to this weakness as it is our soulish nature, removing error from our minds and beliefs is not an easy thing to do…..it takes times and diligence and so we must continue to keep our minds open to receive information which may show us where we might be in error.
The next question we should ask is what did it mean in Jude 6, to leave their own habitation? An interesting point on this word habitation…which is found in Jude 6 and 2 Corinthians 5:3 and is the Greek word “oiketerion” meaning HOME-place or house and has to do with the spiritual body Paul says we will put on when we meet the Lord in the air. Jude said the sinning messengers had left their spiritual body or house….what else could that suggest but that they took on the human body?
The literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 sees this as meaning the sinning messengers left their own natural spiritual bodies and assumed the human soulish body in order to co-habit with mortal women on this earth. As the passage said, with the daughters of ha-Adam not because they were lusting after women, but in order to corrupt humanity with their offspring named the Nephilim, translated as giants in most translations because of their large stature and also translated as mighty men or mighty ones, men of renown, heroes and by Knoch, the distinguished.
This has been a long journey for us in going through the first two verses of Genesis 6:1,2 but I hope we now have a better understanding of the different viewpoints and can understand more clearly the things said in this passage…especially as to who can be called a son of God. If the passage reads the Sons of God/Alueim then these were messengers or angels and the literal view must be acknowledged.
The decision we have to make, was Knoch correct in his translation of alueim being the first born sons of Seth? I am not able to accept it just because Knoch says so, and he gives no proofs and to the contrary with the source of the Sethite theory originating with the Catholic Church this makes me very suspicious.
Let’s now go into Genesis 6:3 and look at some more things said in this passage which need understanding. “And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh; yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.”
Both Knoch and Bullinger in their notes say that this statement is referring to Adam as the man and that he had 120 years left to live. Adam was 810 when this was said and he lived to be 930. Adam was 130 when he begat Seth and so he lived for 800 years after that…we are not told of any more children coming from Adam and Eve but it is logical that they would have produced more children. Bullinger also points out in his notes that the term in this passage of, that he, (Adam) also is flesh would indicate Adam also was sinning in like manner as the rest of mankind…he had become like the others.
Genesis 6:4 KJAV “There were giants in the earth in those days and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men and they bare children to them the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”
Knoch as we have discussed used distinguished in Verse 4 in place of giants or the Nephilim as in the King James it is giants and in the original Hebrew it is the name Nephilim from nph. This can be spelt as Naphal in Hebrew and as Niphal in the Aramaic. In my research it seems the name distinguished comes from Niphal the Aramaic while to fall or the fallen ones or those who fell from Naphal the Hebrew.
In Knoch’s article in Volume 22, he said, “the key to the subject of the Nephilim lies in the meaning of the name. For many years I could not see that any other derivation was possible except nph, Fall. But, since I have analyzed all of the Hebrew word families, and recognize more and more the passive force of the letter n, I have come to admit the possibility of deriving from phl, the passive of DISTINGUISH. This has proven so satisfactory that no doubt lingers in my mind that this is the true signification of nphilim, but DISTINGUISHED”.
“The passive is inherent in the English word, so need not be expressed. In Hebrew roots containing servile letters, which are used in the variations of grammar as well as the formation of roots, some of the forms may be spelled the same as words derived from a shorter root. So here nphl may be the passive form of phl. The matter must be tested by the resultant translation. In Genesis 6:4 the root, DISTINGUISH is far preferable to FALL.”
If this is hard to understand….just know that Hebrew had no vowels, the reader or speaker of it supplied the vowels…it is much more advanced than our English in the sense our Alphabet has supplied both consonants and vowels …does the thinking for us. And also the early scripts were written in Hebrew and Chaldee from the Babylon empire and Aramaic which is a dialect between the Hebrew and Chaldee developed when Israel was living in Babylon for the 70 years.
So the translators would then supply the vowels and that is why in some cases…the word might be different…as in this case of nphl…was it true Hebrew or Chaldee or Aramaic….? The translator would try to decide by the context and the history and of course mostly by the theology of the time…So this is why the name Nephilim could be Nipilim and each with a slightly different meaning. Oh, also when im or him is added to a word this was the Hebrew for a plurality…meaning more than one…so if there had been one of these offspring it most likely would have been…the Nephi…but the whole name implies a plurality of them.
So Knoch chose to accept that the word should be spelt as Nipilim because the distinguished fit more with the Sethite theory. That theory did not originate until the 3rd through 5th centuries by those who could not conceive of angels having the ability for cohabiting with women and thus searched for alternative explanations of Genesis 6:1-4. But I can not forget that the Sethite theory came about in the time frame of the 3rd and 5th centuries when also spiritualizing the Bible by the Catholic Church was the accepted mode of Biblical interpretation and for that very reason alone, the Sethite theory needs close scrutiny!
As I have said, I am surprised that Knoch accepted it for these reasons…but he was a man and limited in time and resources and so could not thoroughly investigate everything…and so it is also with great care that I disagree…which does not mean that I am right….but just that I could not prove for myself that he was. I remain open to any new information on the areas where I find myself disagreeing with Knoch.
Bullinger explains the research he did on the name Nephilim…in Appendix 25 of the Companion Bible as “Progeny of the fallen angels with the daughters of Adam and are called in Genesis 6, the Ne-phil’-im, which means fallen ones…(from naphal, to fall).
So we see the differing opinion on this name…Bullinger accepted the literal view of Genesis 6 and Knoch did not. I am not a language expert so I have to look at the amount of evidence put forth by each for their viewpoint as well as the motives behind the choice made in translating names or words …..was the motive, conscious or unconsciously, theology?
So I did more research on what both Bullinger and Knoch said about the name Nephilim and found as said the difference have to do with the Hebrew or the Aramaic language. In the Hebrew the word of Naphal, meaning to fall or fallen ones and Knoch’s spelling seems to lean towards the Aramaic and the meaning of distinguished.
I found several arguments given against this name’s meaning as to being fallen or fallen ones for the children or offspring of the marriage union referred to in Genesis 6:1-4. The argument is that the name meaning to fall or fallen ones would apply to the sinning messengers and not their children. So this is another reason why some prefer to translate the name as giants as well as that is how the Septuagint translators translated the name…gegenes which is where the word giants originated.
There is a simple explanation why the name was used for the children of the fallen ones, if the Nephilim were their children; the name identified them by or with their fathers’ name. Isn’t it natural for the son to carry the same name as the father? The name would identify them as the progeny of the fallen ones or distinguish them from the rest of humanity as Knoch reasoned was the meaning of the name.
I believe these sinning messengers appeared to humans would have their own personal names….as well as powers and knowledge that caused them to worshipped as gods as indeed their were or are…So for more understanding of these gods…just look at all pagan religions and the legends and myths….the gods in those myths had names and interacted with humans…these stories have there origins in the primitive truth of that ancient world.
So the fallen or the distinguished would aptly describe these one who were different in stature and actions amongst Adams descendants. What is harder for me to understand is how these distinguished ones could be the firstborn sons of Seth who took wives when the context of Genesis 6 suggests the distinguished are the offspring or children of that union.
The Nephilim, giants are the distinguished according to Knoch’s interpretation and these are those who made a name for themselves, men of renown, mighty and etc? Yet when we read the notes in the Concordant it appears as though the distinguished are first said to be the first born sons of Seth as the sons of the alueim, arbitrators or leaders…who took wives and then also that name the distinguished applied to the children they bare and then centuries later after the flood of Noah we find them again in the Numbers account…the sons of Anak? So how would the sons of Anak tied to the firstborn sons of Seth?
We might also ask, how were these ones in the Genesis passage distinguished as nothing is said as to why. But if they were part angel and part human and so larger than Adam’s descendants and given this unique name of either Nephelim, giants or distinguished as their size and behavior invoked fear in normal men that certainly would have distinguished them as different? But if these men were Sethite leaders distinguishable by their rank or office of rulership why doesn’t the scriptural account supply us with this information.
I found another research article done by a Professor Michael S. Heiser PhD, of the Hebrew Bible and Ancient Semitic Languages, University of Wisconsin-Madison, on his research into the word, “Nephilim” in reference to the root word naphal, and meaning “to fall.”
His article was written in response to those who teach the definition of the word, Nephilim as fallen ones, or fell, and fell upon others if coming from the root word naphal. Mr. Heiser brought out “the word Nephilim is formed or spelled two ways in the Old Testament Hebrew text, It is spelled one way in Genesis 6:4 and another way at Numbers 13:33 where it has an extra letter in the spelling.”
He said, “This difference in spelling…the extra letter is critical to understanding where the word does and does not come from, which in turn informs us as to how it should and should not be translated.” (Keep in mind the parts of Old Testament scrolls were in Hebrew, Chaldee and Aramaic and so just as we learned of the two ways of spelling Elohim, Hebrew, and Alueim is the Chaldee or Aramaic.)
Mr. Heiser also explains for us and compares this “slight spelling difference with the difference between the Hebrew and the Aramaic languages which was prevalent at the time as coming from first Babel which later became the empire of Babylon and the reason for the slight difference in spelling as the Hebrew scribes adapted it to the Hebrew”.
We can remember in our studies when the Jews were conquered by Babylon it was required for them to learn the Chaldee language and we have also learned that the book of Daniel is partially written in Chaldee and that Aramaic is a dialect of both and over the centuries…Babylonian speaking Jewish scribes responsible for making copies of the sacred scrolls of scripture translated them into the Chaldee and the Aramaic languages….and then later into the Greek language known as the Septuagint.
Dr. Heiser’s explains in his article, the differences which cause criticism for taking the one spelling as being absolute as he continues “there are better options than relying, on naphal meaning to fall and applying it to the Nephilim….by understanding how close the Aramaic and Hebrew languages are and then why Numbers 13:33 would link the giant clans of Moses day to the Nephilim of Genesis 6; Also why the Septuagint Translation…used by Jesus, the apostles and the early Church reads gigantes for Nephilim in these passages.”
“It also explains why All other ancient Jewish texts from the Intertestamental period that reference the Genesis 6:1-4 event have Nephilim as giants; And all the Jewish and early Christian commentators prior to Augustine took the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 as literally being angelic-human cohabitation that produced a hybrid race of giants.”
So what Mr. Heiser is saying we must factor in all the evidence and not just the one word with the disagreement on how it should be spelt….So it appears he supports the literal view because of the evidence. I have added his thoughts on the argument over the spelling and definition of Nephilim or Nephelim because we can see there is an area of disagreement in how the word or name Nephilim is spelled. This seems to be what Knoch did, which was take the one spelling as absolute and why he preferred the translation of distinguished as it fit his theology of accepting the Sethite theory…better.
But as we have read it is spelt two ways and that is explainable just as Elohim or Alueim can be used with both referring to God and so we may see Nephelim or Nephilim depending on whose article we may be reading and now understand that this is related to the Hebrew, Chaldee and Aramaic influences over time.
Mr. Heiser explained most ancient scripts preferred to use, giants in their translations because of this and because the Nephilim are described in later passages as being quite tall in stature, and described as mighty and violent men. Heiser, pointed out that prior to Augustine…the literal view of these giants was commonly accepted. Augustine was among the first who dismissed this story in Genesis 6 as a fairy tale as he did many other things in scripture and promoted much error which is still believed today as found within many doctrines in Christendom and the sects.
No matter the name…these offspring or children are referred to in the context of Genesis 6 and which implies that the world was very wicked and that wickedness was somehow linked to these offspring whether they were called Nephilim, giants, mighty ones, heroes or distinguished ones.
For me the word distinguished connotes dignity or respectability and so our use of it today doesn’t fit with the use of those spoken of in Genesis 6:4 “men of renown” and the next verse says “the wickedness of man was great in the earth” So great or widespread that God said all flesh was to be removed, that includes the animals of the world…why would they need destruction unless they too somehow had been corrupted? Something we can think about and maybe later get in to what some have put forth as the possible causes of the corruption of the animals were. But to continue with this …name…nphl, Nephilim.
Knoch said in his article, this name was used to differentiate the distinguished ones from the rest of mankind but not as wicked but as the Sethite leaders, as they were distinguished from the rest of mankind being in Seth’s lineage and that Adams daughters were of a higher station and were more fair than any other women and thus these distinguished ones wanted them for their wives. Yet there is nothing in the scriptures which even hints at this scenario to give scriptural support for this explanation, it is speculative.
Also another word used in this passage, heroes it has a different meaning for us today than it did in the past, Bullinger’s notes on this verse says “renown in the Hebrew, the men of the name were the “heroes” of the Greek mythology. The remains of primitive truth, corrupted in transmission.” A primitive truth …primitive relating to the ancient past….became corrupted over time and in different cultures with the embellishments of men’s imaginations.
The use of the word hero, for us today when we hear of a hero, we think of someone who did something very good or heroic in helping someone else. They usually perform some sort of feat that surpassed normal men….which made this stand out. So our meaning of the word today is very different from that of its use in the past. This made me curious so I looked up “hero” in the dictionary and this is what it had to say, “Coming from the Greek, heros 1. A mythological or legendary figure often of divine ascent endowed with great strength or ability.”
The heroes of Greek mythology were stories of giants and superhuman beings, gods which were mingling with humans. Somewhere in time there had to be the original source or a starting point for these tales of gods and giants…so they began with an element of truth which is then expanded on by the imaginations of humans?
We can only look at the context of Genesis 6 to find our answers which merely states this taking of wives by the sons of God and then proceeds to explain how wicked the world was and of Gods intention to destroy all inhabitants but one family! The context links this marriage union with Gods intention to destroy all flesh…so something quite different has been spoken of in this passage and again we ask, why all flesh?
The context seems to link the wickedness to the offspring named the Nephilim which came from the marriage of the sons of God and the daughters of ha adam? If Knoch is correct and the word should be translated as distinguished this could apply to them as being the offspring of angels and women in that it is obvious they would have been quite different, distinguishable from the rest of mankind by their appearance or size and by their actions….they became renown …..according to the context for wickedness in all the earth.
As already stated by I feel bears repeating and that is that the literal interpretation of Genesis 6:1-4 was the accepted view up to the 3rd century, some say even to the 5th and what is more proof for me is that the Septuagint translated by Jewish rabbis two hundred years before Christ came…has translated that passage at Genesis 6:2 “the angels of God.”
Lets now look again at Genesis 6:4 with the three ways it is translated “There were giants, Nephilim or the distinguished in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same become mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”
Now the first thing said is the giants, Nephilim or the distinguished were in the earth in those days which would be the days leading up to the time of Noah and now we make note of the phrase and also after that which would mean after those days of Noah or after the flood. So also after the flood there were again giants, Nephilim or the distinguished in the earth. Twice then we read of these children, of either, the sons of the Alueim or sons of the alueim as men, came in unto the daughters of men and they bare them children for them…and these children they bare are said to be the mighty men of renown….the giants, Nephilim or distinguished.
The and also after that…..would more precisely be the second irruption in the land of Canaan which Israel was given by Jehovah to be their promised land, this was the land promised to Abraham some 400 years before Israel begins her journey to that land from Egypt. How does this fit with the Sethite theory? All the descendants of Seth died in the flood except for Noah and his family….besides…the distinguished were not the firstborn sons of Seth they were the children of the marriages in Genesis 6:1-4.
How do we link what happened in Noah’s day with those in the land of Canaan when Noah’s world perished? When Israel arrives on the scene, at the borders of the land of Canaan…they are told by Jehovah to take possession of that land and also Jehovah told them that certain clans in it were to be killed, every man woman and child. The reason being they were giants and the descendants of giants as we will see soon.
Again Vladimir and Knoch speculation and theories do not hold true…..Knoch held to the Sethite theory but that would no longer fit the land of Canaan and Vladimir in his article said that phrase in Genesis 6:4 ..also after that….could not mean after the flood because the flood had not yet occurred…somehow forgetting that Moses wrote Genesis centuries after the flood of Noah’s day. I again want to assure the reader brother Gelesnoff has written some wonderful articles I have enjoyed very much, but on this subject his reasoning and logic and lack of scripture proof can not allow me to accept his viewpoint.
Now, Moses wrote Genesis…he is inspired to record the days before the flood, perhaps he also has some writings done by Noah…we don’t know, we do know writing done by Enoch have been found and he lived before the flood. But the point being, Moses had first hand experience with the giants living in the land of Canaan as the spies came back and reported of them. I think it is also important to understand that Jewish scribes through the years would add to the scrolls when things foretold came about.
One example of this is the account of Moses death and burial, since he was dead and could not have written of his own death and burial someone else had to add that information to his writings…maybe Joshua or the prophet at the time Samuel or the priests in office at the time….so those of Israel who fought the clans of giants may have added the also after that…? We will look at Israel’s history with these clans further on in this study…lets first review the different issues we have discussed.
We have looked at three arguments against the sons of God being men. If they had been the descendants of Adam…the appropriate term of ha-adham would have been used instead of ha-Elohim or even ha-elohim as Knoch puts forth. And we have an abundance of information showing that the descendants of Adam could not be called sons of God as they were begotten of the flesh and not spirit. And the term, the sons of God in all other passages in the Old Testament is applied only to angels or spirit messengers.
We also have it stated that those sinning against Jehovah are said to be of Satan. 1 John 3:8, “Yet he who is doing sin is of the Adversary, for from the beginning is the Adversary sinning.” Also Jude 19 states, “those going according to their own irreverent desires are soulish, not having the spirit.” So, if these were the firstborn sons of Seth and they had been told not to marry the daughters of Cain or their sisters or “the others” and were doing so, they were following the adversary and sinning against Jehovah, so how could they be said to be the sons of God on that basis either?
To sum up Knoch’s explanation of Genesis 6:1-4 and the differences with the CLV
He did not accept the literal viewpoint and so it seems to me, he altered the translation to fit the Sethite viewpoint. He supplied no scriptures for proof of this view and gave no scriptures to support that Genesis 6:2 should not speak to the Alueim as the Creator but instead to men. His argument with Luke 1:23 of men in the Old Testament being sons of God is also weak as only Adam qualified for that reference as a direct creation with all other passages in the Old Testament referring to spirit beings also direct creations.
His reasons given on why he changed the name Nephelim to the distinguished also falls flat as he applies it first to the sons of the alueim as being the first born sons of Seth but when we look closely at the scripture that name nph is speaking to the children of that marriage union. He said his use of the distinguished fit better or was more satisfactory…and I have to ask fit better with what, scripture or the Sethite viewpoint?
At this point in time I feel I cannot trust the Concordant’s translation of Genesis 6:2 or Verse 4 for the reasons given, thus far the evidence seems to be in favor of the literal viewpoint of Genesis 6:1-4. But let’s continue and look at more of Bullinger’s research which is far more extensive than the others have been.
We will investigate why he speaks of a second irruption, and look also at the scriptures that speak of the dead not rising….which according to Bullinger, these particular passages we will look at, saying the dead and deceased will not rise are translated from the name, Nephilim and Bullinger asks several times why didn’t the translators just use that name consistently? And if Knoch was right, it should then read distinguished…and so it would then read the distinguished will not rise from the dead…??
That would even be more confusing than how it already reads which leads some towards unbelief in the salvation of all. But before we get into that subject, let’s first go through Bullinger’s information on why he accepted the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 which in his day he was going against the standard view passed down from the Catholic Church who had adopted the Sethite theory…and spiritualized scripture.
Dr Bullinger’s research and notes are found in The Companion Bible, Appendix 25, “The Nephilim, or ‘Giants’ of Genesis 6:4”
Also the additional Appendixes touching on things connected to the Nephilim should be read and considered. “The Posterity of Cain,” Appendix 20; “The Sons of God” Genesis 6:2,4, Appendix 23; “Noah Perfect” Genesis 6:9, Appendix 26 and “Nimrod” Genesis 10:8,9 and 1 Chronicles 1:10, Appendix 28.
When I compare the scriptures and evidence Bullinger gives in his notes and these appendixes with what Vladimir and Knoch wrote on this subject I feel he has done far more work in researching this subject and it seems to me to support the literal viewpoint but will leave it to the reader to decide.
Also Bullinger has supplied an abundance of information in Appendix 4, which gives the list of names and titles for God, Lord, Ieue as the name of Yahweh or the English, Jehovah. While Alueim or Elohim is a title tied to Ieue as the Creator, Bullinger says this title of Elohim is found over 2700 times in the Old Testament and has the meaning of chief or head or a leader…both of God and of men.
I am working on Study Manual Four “Who is God” which is an in depth study of the titles and names used by God and His Christ which denote the work He did as Creator and the work He is doing in the redeeming and reconciliation process….the complete salvation of His creation.
The name of Ieue has the meaning of “I shall become what I shall become” and research also shows the expression; “Who was and Who is and Who is to come” is also tied to this name, Ieue. The name of God is found in the Bible over 6000 times. In the KJAV using the English name Jehovah is found 3 times while both Elohim and Ieue are translated as God, GOD, Lord and LORD depending on the translator’s discretion and the context, Bullinger’s notes point out each occurrence of which title or name is being referred to.
We will be going over some of the same information from Genesis 6:1-4 that we have already discussed but adding more details from Bullinger’s research hopefully settling the issue on who were the sons of God and who were the Nephilim and answering the question, can angels cohabit with humans.
Understanding the Hebrew word, “ha-adham”
Genesis 6:1 “And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth and daughters were born unto them.” KJAV. The Concordant “Now it had occurred when humanity had started to increase on the surface of the ground and daughters had been born to them.”
Let’s first review the word, ha’adham is Hebrew for the man Adam. In the KJAV looking at Bullinger’s notes he says on Verse 1 “that men is singular…with the article (ha) and is ha-adam, the man and thus would be speaking of Adam and not men in general. Daughters were born to them; Them i.e. referring to Adam and Eve, as in Genesis 1:27 and 5:2.” So this would literally read, when Adam began to multiply, daughters were born to them, i.e. Adam and Eve.
In the Companion Bible Bullinger’s notes will help the reader to also understand that the previous Chapters Four and Five brings the reader from the genealogy of Adam into the days of Noah and his three sons. But when we begin to read Chapter Six it is important to understand with the first 8 Verses, that it does not go forward in time with Noah but instead goes back in time to Adam and Eve and the beginning of the multiplying of humanity on the earth and of something that took place which brought about the judgment from God….to wipe all flesh off the earth as all flesh was corrupt.
So, within that time frame Genesis 6: 2 indicates something of significance occurred when Adam and Eve began to multiply and up to Verse 8 that is what is being discussed and also explaining why the coming judgment…the Noahic flood and then Verse 9 continues forward with Noah’s genealogy.
Both Knoch and Bullinger indicate that Chapter Six has gone back in time to Adam and Eve and speaking to when they began to have children and of his daughters being born...this of course would mean daughters were on the scene very early on. Especially so if we accept that Cain married his sister and that there were other sons not named who would have married their sisters also not named.
And as they had children and their sons and daughters married and had children and so humanity was multiplying taking the reader into Verse 2 with what was said as being significant and different from any other genealogy given thus far.
Genesis 6:2. That the sons of God saw the daughters of men (Bullinger’s notes again say, singular for the man Adam) that they were fair: and they took them wives of all which they chose.”
So literally, The sons of God saw the daughters of the human, Adam, Bullinger’s notes say,
“the sons of God = angels. While God is, ha-Elohim = the Creator. men; in contrast with angels.
But I think we can say, to those who disagree with this going back to Adam and Eve and their daughters it is safe to say that we could factor in that all the children born of Adam and his sons and their sons would be said to be his daughters as he was the Patriarchal father of all who descended from him.
The point I feel needing to be recognized here is that the what occurred in Verse 2 of the taking as wives the daughters of ha adam by the sons of God could have begun as early on as Adams first generation daughters and continued as his sons had daughters to the point that all flesh is so corrupted God brought judgment on all but Noah, said to be flawless…and his immediate family….if the literal view is correct then the sinning messengers began interfering early on and continued to do so until God put an end to it with the flood.
The book of Enoch states these sons of God came to the earth in the days of Jared…who was Enoch’s father….Enoch fathered Methuselah who fathered Lamech who fathered Noah. This would give us the time frame of around 1000 years before the flood that these sons of God began taking wives. Obviously the book of Enoch explains Genesis 6:1-4 as being the literal arrival of angelic beings who took mortal women for wives.
This book must be credible as Jude 6, 14 is quoted from it and 2 Peter 2:4.5 refers to the sinning messenger locked away in Tartarus. If you are using the King James, the word hell wrongly placed in this passage. In fact if you use a KJAV please us Bullinger’s as his notes will show you where things are wrongly translated.
The book of Enoch was not included in the Bible we have today for whatever reason but it was available for Jude to read and we must factor in the facts given in scripture about Enoch and that Jude quoted directly from it and secular sources speak of it being kept and read in the Jewish community in the days of Jesus. So it was some time after that …that it was discarded. But more on this book and the possible reasons it was discarded later.
So with all that in mind, Verse 2 stands out as something very different happening within the multiplying of humanity and of great significance. “That the sons of God saw the daughters of Adam or men, being his descendants, that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.”
This statement in the line of genealogy now stands out as something more than just an account of some, fair daughters becoming the wives of the firstborn sons of Seth as Knoch puts forth or the view of Vladimir of a pre adamic race intermingling with Adams race.
So literally, The sons of God and the daughters of the human, Adam, Bullinger’s notes, again state,
“the sons of God = angels. While God is, ha-Elohim = the Creator. men; in contrast with angels.”
In the previous chapters leading to Chapter 6 we find the lineage of Adam, a short lineage of Cain and a lineage for Seth but nothing was said of them being a son of God or a leader or ruler. Nothing is said of Seth’s firstborn sons being leaders or rulers, those who are named in the previous accounts link their ancestry to Noah and He and his family will be the sole survivors of the flood. So the term, whether it is sons of God or sons of men is used for the first time in Genesis 6:2.
Also the statement made about their taking of wives was different, standing out in some way from the norm or in importance in relation to these daughters being taken as wives by….the sons of the Alueim or the alueim as Knoch taught these were leaders of men and not angels? Also the term used of bearing children stands out as different from all other accounts….using so and so begat so and so.
If these were the first born sons of Seth and of high importance as leaders at that time…why wouldn’t the account say so and tell us why and why are no names given for these leaders? Now some say that the daughters were of Cain’s line and it was forbidden for Cain and Seth’s children to marry each other, if this was true why is this commandment not recorded and especially if it was being broken by these leaders?
There are no details given which suggest any of these theories, a pre adamic race, the Sethite theory or the Cain and Seth theory, but all are put forth as alternatives to the unacceptable literal view and so all are speculative and suspect for lack of evidence and most important of all, the Sethite view because it became popular at the same time as spiritualizing scripture did, when the Catholic Church was in authority and deciding what was to be believed and what to cover up.
We have looked at the terms used in the first two verses of Genesis 6:1-4 so let’s continue with the rest.
Genesis 6:3 in the KJAV reads “And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with (the) man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.” Bullinger’s notes on this verse are “Strive with man, = remain with man, with the article = strive with the man Adam: he: emphatic for the man Adam. also; i.e. the man Adam also, as well as the others…not men, is flesh but speaking of Adam, is a verb = is flesh has to do with, in their erring…Adam had become like the others….erring. And, Yet his days = yet Adams days would be 120 years…more.”
Bullinger’s stating that this is speaking of the man Adam and not of men in general shown by “he also is flesh.” The also flesh is interesting, yet would we even pause to wonder what was implied…because of course Adam was flesh, a mortal human and all his descendants were flesh and mortals. The meaning behind this term, he also is flesh is explained as “in that he erred or was sinning as the rest of mankind”
Also we might ask, was this erring or sinning as the rest of mankind something more evil than the expected failings of a imperfect human…..a sinner because of the dying process and making mistakes? I think so. One such sin…would be that of idolatry…spawned by the sinning messengers living with humans. But let’s get back and finish the first four verses in Genesis 6.
Genesis 6:3 in the CLV says, “Not abide shall My spirit in the human for the eon, in that moreover, he is flesh. And come shall his days to be a hundred and twenty years.” The KJAV says he was also flesh…while CLV, he is flesh, both showing by the use of the singular ‘he’ it was speaking of Adam and he was 810 at the time and by adding the 120 years puts him at 930 years old when he dies.
In the margin of the CLV Knoch has a note that Adam was 810, so he is also indicating this verse was speaking of Adam and not mankind in general and that it was Adam who had 120 years left to live but if the flood was coming in that amount of time it would apply to the rest of mankind also.
Adams age is verified at Genesis 5:5 “Adam died at the age of 930 years” So we can see this works out correctly as 810 +120 = 930. So, Adam, as the he in this passage is said to have 120 years left to live…!
Many use this for the life span of mankind after the flood but this statement was made before the flood and pertains to Adam before the flood. Adam died before the flood of Noah began. Bullinger’s notes also say, “that Jehovah had pronounced death on Adam after the transgression in Eden and this statement in Verse 3 goes back to that pronouncement….that His spirit or the life force would be withdrawn and the man, he, Adam would die after another 120 years.”
Adam and Eves bodies held a far greater strength than ours do today and so they and their descendants lived a long time, another reason would be they were protected from the direct rays of the Sun due to the cloud cover surrounding the earth until the flood of Noah.
Adam and Eve were said to die in the day that they transgressed and they did die in the day that they were created in and so some will point to one day is as a 1000 years to God. 2 Peter 3:8. Peter gives that number in relation to his previous words concerning the days of Noah and the flood and so it does fit that era….but those words do not mean that all of Gods days are 1000 years long.
After the flood life spans became shorter until we get to the time which is said to be foretold as a basic life span of humanity of three score and ten at Psalms 90:10. Although Bullinger’s notes point to “these words as applying to Israel in their trek in the wilderness as a shortening of the life span, the forty years of wandering was to allow the adults who partook in the sin of rebellion and idolatry at Sinai to die off.”
Genesis 6:3 of he is also flesh is speaking of others as well as of Adam who of course was flesh and so it is in reference to that he was also sinning as were the other humans who were living at that time. Again I repeat myself; he was already in sin from the eating of the fruit in the Garden of Eden disobedience to Jehovah his creator and thus was mortal, dying. Flesh with a soulish nature and so what was this erring or sinning that seems to have surpassed the normal state of sin he and his descendants were already in?
Some will say it was homosexuality, which it is entirely possible that too was going on, but nothing is said of that particular sin in the context, but what is said is in fact the opposite, the marrying or the taking of wives…the daughters of Adam by the sons of God. This statement has to be significant in the context…we were told earlier that the profaning of Jehovah’s name and idolatry was prevalent….worshipping the sinning messengers as gods.
Bullinger gives an interesting analysis of the possible population growth during that era from Adam to the flood in Appendix 20 “The Posterity of Cain,” “If Abel died in A.M. 125, and if both Abel and Cain had children before that year, even supposing they had no descendants till they reached the age of sixty five, Adam could have had 130 children by then.”
“And if each of these could have a child at sixty five years of age, one in each successive year, there would have been 1,219 in A. M. 130. If we suppose Adams earlier sons and daughters to have had children at the age of twenty one instead of at sixty five, there would have been over a half a million in the 130 years, without reckoning the old or young, and this at a very moderate rate of increase.”
“It is generally assumed that Adam and Eve had no children beyond those named. But, as in the line of Seth, it is clear from Genesis 5:4 that they had; we may well conclude that the same was the case in the line of Cain. It is a gratuitous assumption that Abel had no posterity.”
“It is manifest that the history assumes a considerable population and the fact that there is no attempt to explain it, proves it genuineness, and show that, we are left to explain it for ourselves in the only natural way by which it can be explained.”
I have read other estimates of the population growth based on the generations and their life spans from Adams descendants multiplying until the flood ranging from one billion and forty billion….boggles my mind but we forget how much longer they lived then. The estimates of the possible growth of humanity in those days should help us to see to what a large scale the human population had become and also they had spread into the entire world or land area of the time.
Most likely before the flood, the continents were all connected as one large land mass breaking up after the flooding waters receded into what we see in the world today. I think after the flood and Noah left the ark, the waters would have continued to recede…and so some continents most likely were connected for some time….like how close Alaska is to Russia….my guess that is how those who populated North America got here…or perhaps by boat.
It is highly likely that after the flood is when continents were separated into how we find them in the world today. The connectedness of the land mass in its original state… also explains why fossil remains are found in the entire world, of human, giants, the Neanderthal man.
These three types of skulls and bones have been found and existed at the same time period and so it is possible the Neanderthal man was the offspring of the Nephilim…who were the giants. The Neanderthal man was not a giant, but his skull was different from what is called modern man, those descended from Adam and even. His skull was very large with a pronounced forehead and differences in his jaw as well as being shorter and stocky.
The literal view of Genesis 6 answers many questions not answered by the Sethite view.
Now for Genesis 6:4
The next thing to look at again in Genesis 6:4 has to do with the use of the word or name, the Nephilim giants, heroes, mighty ones, and Knoch using distinguished.
Genesis 6:4 KJAV reads “And there were giants in the earth in those days: and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, The same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”
The CLV reads “Now the distinguished come to be in the earth in those days, and, moreover, afterward, coming are those who are sons of the Alueim to the daughters of the human, and they bear for them. They are the masters, who are from the eon, mortals with the name.”
The Jewish Study Bible Verse 4 reads “Nephilim appeared on earth…when the divine beings cohabited with the daughters of men, who bore them offspring. They were the heroes of old,
the men of renown.”
Bullinger’s notes, state that “Nephilim is a proper noun and a name and should just have been left as such.” While Knoch disagreed and chose to use distinguished as he leaned towards a variation in the spelling, in the article he wrote in Volume 22 of the UR of which we have already discussed. So again Knoch believed these were distinguished men, and so translated alueim for leaders of men in Seth’s line as it is assumed to be the righteous line.
While Noah was in Seth’s line there must have been many others which did not make the cut when the flood came. There is no scriptural evidence for this Sethite view it is merely an alternative viewpoint to the literal explanation for Genesis 6:1-4.
We must stick with what we are told in scripture and the name nph was used for some reason and find it doubtful in reference to the human leaders or chiefs of that time. Also in the context of what immediately follows Verse 4 which named the Nephilim in the earth is what is said in Genesis 6:5-8 of the world being so wicked that God determines to destroy all flesh in it.
The context of these verses would not be random events or simple thoughts and unconnected. How could it be talking about the multiplying of humankind in normal marriages which links to what is said next, the wickedness and corruption of all flesh and the coming judgment by God, to wipe out all flesh?
If Genesis 6:2 and 4 was simply as the Sethite theory, puts forth, talking only of the marriages with the leaders of men with either Adams daughters or Cain’s… why would all humanity and all animals need to be judged worthy of destruction? What is said in these two verses relates somehow to the coming judgment. Somehow the animals, birds and etc as they were included in the statement, of all flesh were also corrupted and there are legends which indicate their DNA had been interfered with and before the reader reacts with disbelief…let’s remind ourselves of the super beings the angels or sinning messengers…under Satan are.
If we open our minds to look again at the myths and legends concerning the false gods worshipped in every country of the world which originated in that first era of mankind as originating with literal events…the possibilities of what was going on in that pre flood world are mind boggling. Christendom has fed us simple stories leaving out the real meanings of many scriptures.
One book I recently read talked of how something happened between the invention of the wheel and the later invention of the cart by ancient humans and that would be likened to the Rolls Royce coming on the scene in between those two inventions…but not by humans by another superior race…? Archeology shows humans with primitive tools and then mathematically perfect pyramids and knowledge of the solar systems.
So since we do not believe in the pre adamic races spoken of…what is left…but the race of Nephilim…the offspring of the sinning messengers. Those messengers under Satan did not remain invisible to humans but appeared to them, shared their knowledge, displayed their powers and were worshipped as gods. Always remembering the goal was to corrupt humanity and thwart Gods purpose for creating humanity. But let’s get back to our passage.
The comments in Genesis 6:1-4 which precede the announcement of the coming judgment must supply the reason it. New information was given, not the normal genealogy as given previously. This chapter tells of the Nephilim being the offspring or children of the sons of God and the daughters of Adam and this is the foundation of the context as to why all flesh was corrupted and needed destroying. Not due to sin as a result of the curse of death from Adam passed onto his descendants but something outside of that realm demanding a complete cleansing of the earth and preserving the one uncorrupted family.
The wickedness worthy of destruction began before Noah’s day as the implication within the context of the first four verses goes back in time to Adam and his daughters and or the daughters of his sons, at some point in time…. the sons of God began taking wives who bore children or offspring which became the mighty men of renown….these actions of the sons of God and their supernatural offspring corrupted all flesh and led humanity into all imaginable sin. Reminding ourselves of the possible population growth, if the marriage of angels and mortal women began early on….can we contemplate the number of the Nephilim in the earth?
Lets next look at the genealogy of Seth…to Noah is given as such….Seth, Enos, Cainan, Mahalaeel, Jared…Enoch. Methuselah, Lamech, Noah. Genesis 5:6-31
Methuselah was 180 when he begat Lamech who was 182 when he fathered Noah who was 600 years old when the flood came. So the world was deemed worthy of destruction long before Noah was born and I feel it is safe to assume the interference with Adams daughters indicates it began early on.
Enoch was Noah’s great grandfather and he prophesied against the sinning messengers of his day as Jude 6, 14, 15 said and so he foretold the coming judgment of God for Noah’s day before Noah was born. Methuselah was born when Enoch was 65 and he lived to be 969 years old and his name means “when he dies it shall be sent” and so that is 904 years. Enoch was a man of faith and he wrote a book concerning those times and prophesied of a time we would see as the end times still ahead for Israel.
So as we have discussed, it is generally taught, mankind became so wicked that God had to destroy them, why would such an extreme measure be needed by Jehovah in dealing with humans, since they all were to grow old and die and is not death the wages of sin?
Some sort of wickedness was going on that was so evil it corrupted all flesh and it cannot be denied that it was tied to these sinning messengers who had left their own habitation and bore children who by the way I feel also had children of there own, the intermarriage corrupted all families descended from Adam…only the heritage of Noah and his three sons was untouched.
The literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 would explain Jude 5-7 and 13-15 and 2 Peter 2:4,5 and many other things and there is no other explanation given for why these messengers are locked up. If it was not something to do with humanity why would any reference even be made to them.
Let’s return to what was said about Noah in Genesis 6:8-10 “But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. These are the Generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations and Noah walked with God. And Noah begat three sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth.”
The context up to Verse 8 are the reasons for the coming judgment of God of which Verse 13 says “And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before Me; for the earth is filled with violence through them and behold I will destroy them with the earth.” The “them” are those talked of in Verse 4 whether translated as the Nephilim, giants, mighty ones, heroes or the distinguished.
From before the Garden of Eden, God knew that Adam and Eve would sin and that sin and death would inflict all their offspring. In fact as we have learned, God planned the remedy before the problem even existed as Christ was slain before the world and as the Lamb of God. 1 Peter 1:19,20
So through Christ all mankind was to be redeemed from sin and death. This wickedness which caused regret or sadness to Jehovah sounds like something far worse that just the natural progression of sinful acts of imperfect humans marrying each other and even of idolatry? Jehovah told man to multiply and fill the earth, no rule was given of who they could or could not marry in Genesis 1 through Chapter 6.
Noah and his three sons and their wives, it seems were the only family not corrupted by this intermarrying with the sons of God. Yet they too had inherited the Sin and the Death from Adam…so they were not sinless as to be the meaning of being found flawless, or perfect and so it must mean something else so let’s take a quick look at this word perfect or flawless.
Noah, found perfect or flawless.
In the Companion Bible at Appendix 26. Dr.Bullinger discusses the word “Perfect” in relation to Noah, implying it had to do with his pedigree not being corrupted through the prevalent wickedness, immorality and of the intermarriage of mortals and angels which had corrupted Adam’s descendants.
Noah was found to be perfect or flawless and this is assumed to mean he was righteous but the word used is “tamilym” and has nothing to do with being righteous, it means unblemished or uncorrupted physically. This same word is found in Exodus 12:5, 29 Leviticus 1:3. 10; and about 60 other places all having to do with physical blemishes of the animal offerings. Genesis 6:12 “And God looked upon the earth, and behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.”
This indicates Noah’s family was not sinning in the way the rest of humanity had been and were not corrupted or blemished by the intermarriage of the sinning messengers with the mortal women. All flesh was corrupt….even the animals? Jewish history speaks to some of things that were going on in that pre flood world such as cannibalism and sexual acts with animals by the sinning messengers and Nephilim.
So Bullinger’s thoughts are that Noah and his family were the only family whose human seed had not been contaminated by intermarriage with the sinning messengers or their offspring the Nephilim, or giants. This is what is meant by he was perfect or flawless in Gods sight…certainly not that he was a truly righteous person because he too was contaminated with Adams sin….but how important it was for the lineage from Adam to Noah to be kept purely Adams lineage…as it was to produce the seed that redeems!
Bullinger extensively wrote of Satan in his role as the adversary attempting to thwart God’s purpose and His Word. Jehovah told Eve she would produce a seed that would redeem humanity and would crush Satan’s head. Genesis 3:15
Also in Jude we notice what is said about that judgment, the flood of Noah’s day, “the Lord came with 10,000 of his angels” this force must have been needed because of the sinning messengers as the humans were no kind of opposition to even one messenger or against the flood waters? Perhaps those angels coming with the Lord had the job of capturing and putting the sinning messengers into the prison Peter and Jude refers to, 2 Peter 2:4,5 and 3:5-7
The scripture in Genesis 6 said that all flesh was corrupt and must be destroyed and so all flesh died in that flood except for Noah and his family. The Nephilim would have died, whoever they were, but keep in mind if angels did enter humanity, taking wives of mortal women….they were capable of returning to the spirit world and would not have drowned in the flood, thus that would explain the need for the Lord to come with 10,000 of his angels to capture and confine those sinning messengers to prevent them from more of their interference or perhaps from taking back their spiritual body as we need to find an explanation for the spirits spoken of in the scriptures in Jesus day which had no bodies and these are those which would possess a human body and in most cause physical and mental disorders.
I also wonder if this could be considered as a form of death for spirit beings? These beings it seems do not or cannot die as humans….ceasing to exist but I don’t believe they have immortality either. Paul said only Christ had immortality at 1 Timothy 6:13-16.
In regards to the name the Nephilim meaning to fall or fallen some feel this would only apply to the sinning messengers, while it sounds like in the passage to be referring to their children. The name Nephilim comes from nph or Naphal and means to fall thus these are some of the reasons for some of the confusion. The sinning messengers would be the fallen ones…the straying stars of Jude. Being the offspring of these straying stars…I see nothing strange that they would assume the name given their fathers…the fallen ones or sons of the fallen ones.
But it was the children or offspring which were the giants, the men of renown…for the evil they caused and in all accounts concerning them obscured in the KJAV by not using the name consistently as is are described as being tall and fearsome. Goliath was 13 feet tall using the metric system in the Bible and that is twice the size of a normal man and that would be fearsome. Although in all the drawings found on the walls of pyramids and other ancient temples throughout the entire world…show their false gods as standing much taller than the humans worshipping them.
The name Nephelim could be given the children or offspring of these spirit beings and could have been given the sinning messengers also because they were the fallen ones, fallen from heaven, fallen from favor with their Creator…as said earlier the fathers name given to their offspring, a name or label identifies one.
I would like to briefly insert here other passages where the messenger or angels are said to be stars and where Satan’s messengers are referred to as stars. Please look up Job 38:7, Psalms 148:3, Daniel 8:10
and Revelation 1:20; 9:12; 12:4,7.9
Another question which is also given as an objection by some, did the sinning messengers have the ability to appear in human form? First I would remind us, they are referred to as men when they interacted with humans. They are a spirit man…while Adam was created a fleshly man which limits humanity from leaving their realm, but the spirit men did not have that restriction. Also, Jude and Peter both said they left their natural estate or habitation.
Another point to consider on the word used in Jude for the bodies these fallen messengers left is “oiketerion” and it is found in only two places, Jude 1:6 “And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation.”
We can compare this to how Paul used the same word oiketerion in 2 Corinthians 5:2 “For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven;” We can see by Paul’s usage of oiketerion translated as house, he is speaking to the spiritual body we will be clothed with, given at the snatching away to meet the Lord in the air…..equipping us to live in heaven and to deal with the celestial beings.
At that time Satan will be placed beneath our feet….the glory of the Lord will be given to each member of His body and we will outshine all celestial beings even Satan. It is fitting that we meet the Lord in the air as the air is designated the atmosphere surrounding this planet and is Satan’s domain, where his throne is over this earth. Christ will gather us together in Satan’s domain and he will be powerless to interfere and Gods redeeming ability through His grace will be manifested as we then ascend with the Lord to His throne.
What would be natural to the messengers is the spirit realm and what is natural to them is a spiritual body although it is the form of man. There are the accounts of the man, Gabriel, seen by Daniel at Daniel 9:21 and the man clothed in linen who was above the waters and speaks to him at Daniel 12:6,7
We have the accounts of Jehovah appearing in the human form as a Man, such as when Jehovah and the two messengers with Him appeared to Abram, and had a meal with him. The two messengers then went on to visit with Lot in the city of Sodom and the inhabitants of that city saw them as good looking men. Genesis 18:1-27, describes them first as Alue Elohim and then as three men, the CLV says mortals…this I do not understand other than perhaps in the aspect they appeared as mortals would appear but the account shows they were Jehovah and two of His spirit messengers?
As Verse 27, Abraham says, “behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the LORD, which (I) am but dust and ashes;” Genesis 19 begins with “And there came two angels to Sodom at evening as Lot sat in the gate of Sodom” This is the account where the men of the city wanted these two messengers referred to as men in Verse 10 and they were not mortal men as they had the ability to blind the men banging on the door…they were the messengers of the LORD, telling Lot and his family to leave the city as it was going to be destroyed.
Bullinger’s notes on this verse point to the notes on Genesis 13:7 which say, “the strife Lot and Abram were having was with the Canaanite and Perizzite…which dwelled then in the land and his notes point out these were the Nephilim occupying the land Jehovah promised to Abram.
Also on Verse 10 the notes point out that the name “Sodom means flaming, burning and Gomorrah, the people of fear. Already mixed up in the sins of the Nephilim” What is significant by this is why Sodom and Gomorrah was completely destroyed having more to do with their relationship to or as Nephilim than just homosexuality.
Getting back to angels being spiritual men, these accounts indicate that the angels or messengers have the human form as they did appear to men, as men and they did eat which a spiritual body does not need physical food…but they are able to adapt their bodies to perform acts that our bodies are designed to do. These beings are superior to humanity, as they can come and go, and adapt to humanity while humanity cannot become a spiritual body or change our form to adapt to theirs. Psalms 103:20 describes them as “His angels, excel in strength,”
Another incident of either a messenger of the Lord or it was the LORD and this was when Joshua saw a man at Joshua 5:13,14 “And it came to pass, when Joshua was by Jericho, that he lifted up his eyes and looked and behold there stood a Man over against him with His sword drawn in His hand; and Joshua went unto Him and said unto Him art thou for us or for our adversaries? And He said, Nay; but as Captain of the host of the LORD am I now come.”
It is clear that at least one of the species of angelic beings has the form of humans and if the messengers of the Lord could appear to humanity so could also those following Satan. I suspect that in Genesis, at the creation of humanity, the words, Let Us be making man in our image…was the Elohim, Creator speaking to His faithful messengers who also have the human form contrary to what the Trinitarians would have us believe what is meant by the US….God being three persons and talking to Himself.
Angelic beings are powerful and have abilities humans do not have and so if the sinning messengers appeared to humanity, and interacted with them, they would have had powers, mortals did not have and this would lead to their being worshipped as gods. This was idolatry amongst the descendants of Adam and Eve and these gods are the originators of all false religion of which all can trace their roots back to those ancient times, sad to say even Christendom and many things taught today in Judaism.
False religion did not begin with the imaginations of men although it has been added to in that way down through the centuries, but it had at its source a sinning messenger, appearing as a god to the people. These evil spirits are also called demons. In Paul’s day he warned the believers against being deceived by the doctrines of demons because they were prevalent in the world then and they are still dominating our world today. 1 Timothy 4:1-3.
After the flood this started up again with more of Satan’s sinning messengers appearing to men…..when at the tower of Babel, God confused their languages and caused them to be scattered forming other nationalities the sinning messengers went along with them. So the basic false religion was then in the new languages forming a variety of ways for these god to be worshiped. All we have to do is review the myths of every country and we will find false gods with many different names.
It is believed by some that all spirit beings do not have bodies or forms, I think the scriptures have proven other wise…we have read some which do speak of messengers appearing as men and we have descriptions of Cherubims which are not baby angels but mighty warriors said to have wings also the Seraphim are described with some sort of body and wings also.
But there does seem to be a class without bodies…which seemed to be plaguing humanity in Jesus day seeking humans to possess and making some of them mentally and or physically ill or deformed. Some demons gave their human medium, powers and insights. We will investigate these later on…but briefly I feel these spirits without bodies and who are also referred to as demons or devils may be the sinning messengers who left their natural habitation, their spiritual body to take on the human body after the flood.
As for those before the flood came, left the human form but were not allowed to return to their spiritual bodies and in fact the 10,000 messengers said to come with the Lord locked them in Tartarous. The book of Enoch describes this also, as though he were seeing it happen… “they were captured by the Lord and His angels and thrown into an abyss, a deep dark crevice in the earth.”
Some of Satan’s workers were locked away and yet God allowed Satan to continue his work and we are told that he will have 1/3 of the stars of heaven at the time of his being cast out of heaven and to also be the god of this world at Revelation 12:3 and 2 Corinthians 4:4. Jehovah allowed Satan to place a (demonic) prince over each and every government in this world as well as to deceive humanity through a multitude of false religions and yet some messengers in the days before the flood did something so wicked or so detrimental to Gods purpose for and with humanity that they have been placed in a prison and so we need to ask, what did they do and why
We are told “the sinning messengers left their natural habitat and are being kept in bonds for the judging of the great day.” Jude 6 and Jude 14 speak of these as straying stars for whom the gloom of darkness has been kept and also speaks of Enoch who prophesied to those messengers in the days of Noah. We are told, by Peter that sinning messengers were put in Tartarous for having done something so wicked that they were locked away while Satan and his many other followers are still running loose and deceiving mankind and so what else could leaving your natural state mean other than these spirit men left their spiritual bodies and took on the human body for the purpose of taking wives…all that they chose and bearing children with them…..who are referred to in scripture as giants, mighty men of renown, heroes.
Jude 13,14 speaks of this prison, Tartarous as the gloom of darkness and of twice dying and of straying stars. This is an interesting passage as it seems the straying stars are another reference to the sinning messengers who are being kept in the gloomy tartarous...but what is this twice dying?
Perhaps the first death is there not being able to or not allowed to take back the spiritual body and or being placed in prison. The twice dying might fit with the second death….as Satan and his followers will be placed into the second death for the process of bringing them to reconciliation. These are just possible thoughts, since we are not told exactly what death means in relation to the sinning angels.
Jude quoted from the book of Enoch which has been found in several places, in the dead sea scrolls and the Ethiopic translation of it is referred to by Knoch when he wrote his Concordant commentary and these have since been translated into English which can be found on the internet…I have a copy and have read it…..but more on what else Enoch had to say in his book later in this article.
So what of the second irruption, those after the flood which occupied the land of Canaan again marrying mortal women, baring children, the giants and waiting for Israel to arrive so as to once again corrupt the line leading to the seed promised to be the redeemer and to crush Satan’s head?
The offspring, the giants and those they produced were killed by the armies of Israel as Jehovah had instructed them and He helped them in their battles as Deuteronomy 2:36.37 says, “ From Aroer, which is by the brink of the river of Arnon, and from the city that is by the river, even unto Gilead, there was not one city too strong for us; the LORD our God delivered all unto us; Only unto the land of the children of Ammon thou camest not, nor unto any place of the river Jabbok, nor unto the cities in the mountains, nor unto whatsoever the LORD our God forbad us.”
So history shows it was 400 plus years from Abram until Moses brought the Israelites out of Egypt heading for the land of Canaan which Jehovah promised Abram was to be theirs….but the land was inhabited by the clans of the Canaanites….and reported among them were many clans of giants…..translated from the same word in Genesis for giants….Nephilim. Genesis 15:1-21
Israel was used by Jehovah…to annihilate the clans of the giants in the land of Canaan. This put fear in the other countries as these clans were not only feared because they were giants but for their warfare… to hear that Israel wiped out these clans of giants instilled fear of Israel for a time. In Verses 17-21 Jehovah lists the peoples living in the land promised Israel, there are 10 nations listed and linked to Genesis 6 with the Rephaim another name for the giant clans.
The Israelites were not to war with the Moabites and the Edomites as they were the descendants of Lot and Esau…so these were relatives of Israel. Each of these men had also been given land by Jehovah centuries previously and Jehovah had helped them also to remove the clans of giants from their lands. There is a interesting things said in Genesis 15:16…when Jehovah was made that first covenant with Abram, the one he slept through, Jehovah tells him he is going to die and not see this promised but in the fourth generation from him, his descendants through Isaac will take possession of the land promised to Abram. Verse 16 says “But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.” So I looked over to see what Bullinger had to say on what I underlined…and his note says, “Another mark of the corruption of the Canaanite nations through the Nephilim and Rephaim.”
Verses 19-21 lists the occupants of the land which Israel would encounter when they arrived and were told by Jehovah to evict. “The Kenites and the Kenizzites and the Kadmonites, and the Hittites, and Perizzites, and the Rephaims. And the Amorites and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites and the Jebusites.” The either were the result of the second irruption of angels taking humans for wives or they were contaminated by it….and these are those Jehovah said to kill every man, woman and child and sometimes even their animals. Jehovah knew which peoples were contaminated by the seed of Satan. These people could not be allowed to contaminate the Israelites through who….the seed of the woman, Christ was to come.
Bullinger’s notes also point out “Israel has never yet occupied the land given to them to the full extent of the borders which are listed here.” “from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates.” And yet…the preterists those which spiritualize scripture and claim all prophecy is fulfilled and as such Israel is no longer in the picture….forgetting God has yet to fulfill all of His word given to and about these People…..and the first covenant made with Abram in Genesis 15 is the guarantee…as Abram slept through it and so only was Jehovah bound by it. ….and He is faithful even when His People are not.
But what of the spirit beings who assumed the human form so as to marry women and fathered these clans of giants….there was no 10,000 messengers sent to lock them in Tartarus with the first irruption.
What happened to the spirits when the human host and their offspring were killed… it is logical that they would not be allowed to return to the former estate of a spiritual body yet were not put in Tartarus as those before the flood and so would find themselves without a body and so these very well could be the disembodied sprits confined to the earth that we read about in Jesus day…those who possessed humans and causing many infirmities? As in the case of those possessing a human and when Jesus cast them out did not want to be without a form and were cast into the herd of swine? Mark 5:13, Luke 8:33
There are some interesting theories…one is they went to other lands and possessed or took on the human form…because in Cambodia and the Aztecs in Mexico…are found ancient pyramids very similar to the Egyptian pyramids but built centuries after those in Egypt and the Ziggurats, a pyramid type structure found in Babylon and other places……with the cause of these being linked to the intellect of the sinning angels. But getting back to the sinning messengers leaving their own estate and not be allowed to take it back and yet they don’t die or cease to exist as a human does.
As I said earlier not having a body may be a form of death for spirit beings…as some sort of restriction was imposed upon those before the flood and if sinning messengers again took on human form and or possessed a human married women and produced more Nephilim or giants in the land of Canaan, when Israel’s armies began invading the cities and killing all men women and children where did the messengers go when the body they inhabited died. This seems to explain the spirits with no bodies of their own.
So some ask, is it possible the sinning messengers are able to do this in our day…I don’t know, but I do believe the death on the cross gave Christ the right to limit these beings in the power they had before the cross…..but this needs more study on my part, I am still looking for more answers to this but did find one brother who thought the spirits with not being allowed to take back their spiritual bodies or form were experiencing a form of death.
Alexander Thomson in his article provided later in this lesson, writes that he believed the sinning messengers not being allowed to take back their spiritual body was a form of death for their leaving their own estate or habitation in order to take on the human body and this meant they were unclothed when the human body died in the flood as they were not allowed or unable to return to their former spiritual body.
Knoch says nothing on this verse about twice dead or twice dying and neither does Bullinger, I tried to find information on it and most who did comment on it were the believers in hellfire and or a spiritual death and so applied it in those ways and to men. Yet in the context Jude had been talking of the sinning messengers and with the reference to the straying stars and in the context of twice dead or twice dying.
It seems Jude like Peter used the days of Noah as an example in warning the saints that God would judge those rebelling against Him in the future as He had judged those in the past. He judged the sinning messengers, and all flesh on the earth in the flood of Noah. He judged the occupants of the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah who it is said went after strange flesh…which means that which was not natural to them or could be other than human flesh besides the same sex. So it was not natural for a messenger to take on flesh nor is it natural for a man to lie with a man…..so there is more to what Jude was implying in his remarks, but maybe it will become clearer later on?
Some also believe the disembodied spirits or demons are the spirits of the Nephilim? But the Nephilim were the children of the messengers and it appears there are a few scriptures which state that the Nephilim will not be resurrected so I would lean more towards the fallen angels being the disembodied spirits Jesus dealt with in his ministry and of which many were locked away in Tartarus... We will look at all the scriptures which seem to infer that the Nephilim are not going to receive a resurrection a little further on.
It is logical then if these sinning messengers cohabited with humans and produced a race of superhuman men, who were called giants because of their size and feared because of their wickedness and violence. This would have been how Satan sent his seed into humanity in order to corrupt the women’s seed….Adam’s lineage. God would need to remove not only them but all those that had been corrupted by them and it is possible that we just do not even understand to what lengths the lineage of Adam was corrupted but the severity of the judgment, that all flesh was destroyed in the flood certainly hints at something of magnitude.
So Satan would have his seed and as foretold, there would be enmity between the woman’s seed and his seed. There are many views on who Satan’s seed are. The first and logical thought is of course those in the spirit realm that he convinced to follow him as he opposes Jehovah, but he did not create them they are his followers. The next thought is those of humanity who also disobeys or opposes Jehovah thus helping Satan in his work as adversary, knowingly or not as we know figuratively this to be true because Jesus even said to Peter, get behind me Satan.
We know Peter was not literally Satan or literally his seed; it was Peter’s actions or thought process that was opposing God’s purpose. The third thought is that Satan’s literal seed would be the offspring or children of the marriage between the sinning messengers following Satan and mortal women. This would be the corrupting of Adams lineage which through Eve was to come the promised seed that would redeem humanity and crush Satan’s head…..which of course would include the crushing of his followers. Those choosing to follow Satan also had their existence at stake and would work at thwarting Gods purpose.
There is also a ridiculous teaching, I found when researching this subject which is that Satan and Eve had sex and Cain was Satan’s seed, his literal offspring and from Cain came the Jews. The first two are easily seen in the scriptures and the third is the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 that we are looking into, the fourth is discarded, as nonsense as there is no scriptural evidence for this in fact Genesis 4:1 says “And Adam knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain…” This nonsense is put out by those who hate the Jews and claim they are the true Israel of God.
In Bullinger remarks, he explains this intermarriage was how the adversary through his seed interfered with mankind in an attempt to corrupt Adams race and to prevent the Seed from coming as prophesied at Genesis 3:15. If this is true, his seed made a significant impact on humanity, requiring Jehovah to wipe all flesh off the earth but for 8 persons, Noah and his family. Genesis 6:4-7
It seems to me something pretty devastating above and beyond the normal sins of men and in the context and subject of this chapter we find the sons of God marrying woman, bearing children named the Nephilim who became the mighty men of renown. Are we to believe these were Seth’s descendants, why are they not named if they were so mighty and why are we not told renown for what?
The context supplies the answer to that with the information on why God is bringing a judgment worthy of all flesh being destroyed on the earth! Genesis 6:11-13 “The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. And God looked upon the earth and behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth. And God said unto Noah, the end of all flesh is come before Me; for the earth is filled with violence through them and behold I will destroy them with the earth.”
Again we have a contrast….all flesh….and violence through them and I will destroy them with the earth. Who were the, them? These mighty men of renown….the offspring of the sons of God and mortal women.
How could humanity have grown so wicked and violent without an outside source? Let’s look some more of what is said about Enoch. Genesis 5:21-24 says “And Enoch walked with God: and he was not: for God took him.” This phrase walked with God implies direct communication. We can compare with Genesis 3:8-10 which speaks of Adam and Eve hearing Jehovah walking in the Garden.
Enoch was in the line of Adams son Seth. Genesis 5:6-24 He is spoken of five times in both the Old and New Testament. Genesis 4:17 and 5:18, 22; Luke 3:37; Hebrews 11:5 and at Jude 14. As said earlier, Enoch is quoted from a book which he wrote called the book of Enoch.
As I said earlier, parts of it have been found through out the centuries but the latest and oldest find was in the Dead Sea scrolls. While there are some which was translated into English in the early 1900’s, it must be read carefully as the translation follows the KJAV which puts forth the hellfire doctrine. This is not Enoch’s fault but the translator’s bias due to their theology….as Enoch as do the Bible speak of fire in the mode of judgments….but I always think of the passage which tells us God is a consuming fire and He certainly is not Hellfire anything that God consumes is either gone or purified.
We read in Jude 6 of these “messengers who keep not their own sovereignty but leave their own habitation,” We are also told that Enoch prophesied at Jude 14 Jude quotes from the book Enoch in Verse 15,16 concerning how in that day “the Lord came with 10,000 of his messengers to do judging of all..” For Jude to quote from the book of Enoch wouldn’t that mean it was accepted as accurate history or that it was inspired of God?
Something I found interesting in the book of Enoch is that he writes of the messengers or angels explaining that some being good and some bad, he writes of how they interacted with man and in fact taught them about the heavens, the stars and planets and their placements in the solar systems…this would have been the beginning of astronomy and astrology. Have you ever wondered how primitive man could know so much about the stars and the constellations without telescopes…I always have?
The book of Enoch, speaking about the messengers or angels by the title of “the watchers” he said it was their job to watch over humanity and that these angels overstepped their boundaries and showed men how to mine ore and metals and to make farm tools and weaponry implements from those ores. Also they gave instruction in mathematics, astronomy, charting the stars with the Zodiac among the things these spirit beings taught humans.
He also speaks of these angels who married the women and taught them the use of herbs for medicine…as well as poisons, along with the casting of spells, thus the beginnings of witchcraft. Again, this makes sense, as how could primitive mankind have figured so much out so quickly without what we call modern technology? Of course all of these things would lead to idolatry with humans worshipping and obeying these messengers.
In the book of Enoch, he also gives a list of names of some of these sinning messengers as the chiefs who had 10 angels under each of them. He states that they were interfering with humanity and God sent him to warn them of the judgment that they would receive for doing this. He writes of 200 of these chiefs who then had those under them.
I looked to see if the name, the watchers is in the scriptures and found it at Daniel 4:13 “I saw in the vision of my head upon my bed, and behold a watcher and a holy one came down from heaven:” Also this name is found in Verses 17 and 23. The CLV has rouser instead of watcher?
The book of Enoch up until the 3rd century, Augustine’s time had been accepted by the saints as part of the Jewish Canon of writings…either as history or inspired? In it, Enoch talks at length of the sinning messengers and the involvement they had with humanity in his day. He also foretold the coming judgment which happened in Noah’s day and he was told it would not come until after his son Methuselah was dead.
The rest of the book of Enoch seems to prophesy to the end times of the latter days before the redeemer comes and it is said that is one of the reasons Augustine wanted it removed as he was the father of spiritualizing the scriptures. He taught there was no literal return of Christ and that He had already come at A.D. 70. He taught there would be no millennial reign on this earth and that Israel was cast off forever and the Body of Christ….more especially the Catholic Church, was the new spiritual Israel.
In the book of Enoch he elaborates on Genesis 6 and corroborates the marrying of angels and women and of their offspring being giants and violent men and of the earth becoming increasingly wicked because of their corrupting humanity and the animal kingdom.
Again, Genesis 6:11 said that “the earth was filled with violence, through them” and Verse 12 says that “the earth was corrupt and all flesh was corrupted” So the question we asked about…through them, who are the, them? It would seem to me the sinning angels and their corrupting influence as well as their offspring.
We found some other interesting things spoken of in Jude, lets review them again, Jude 13-15 “Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesies to these also” Who are the, these…in that statement? For the answer we need to back up to the previous verse, Jude says “straying stars, for whom the gloom of darkness has been kept for an eon.”
Enoch prophesied to the straying stars…of the coming judgment of God, which would be the flood of Noah for the earth and the imprisonment of the messengers which left their estate of Jude 6 and Jude describes them as, straying stars. Jude 13. That quote seems to fit in with what Jude spoke of and going back to what Peter wrote concerning the days of Noah in 2 Peter 2:4,5 and 3:5-7 in reference to what was written in the book of Genesis as well as in the book of Enoch.
In the book of Enoch, he spoke of those called the watchers and he gave the names of some who were the chiefs with 10 angels under each of them. He states that they were interfering with humanity and that God sent him to warn them of the judgment that they would receive for doing this.
Peter and Jude are said to be the two witnesses needed to confirm that Enoch was a prophet of God as well as Moses who recorded the Genesis account. Genesis does not speak of sinning messengers being locked away, but the book of Enoch and Jude and Peter certainly do and linked with the days of Noah.
The third witness would be the writer of Hebrews as Enoch is listed among the faithful at Hebrews 11:5 as having Faith in God and pleasing Him. Verse 13 states all those which were listed in the previous verses had “died in faith having not been requited with the promises.” Since Enoch died in faith, his prophesies must have been inspired of God. Also the term, in faith is talked about by both A. E. Knoch and Bullinger in their notes or commentary.
They both point to Romans 10:17 in reference to what is said of Enoch prophesying and having died in faith. Bullinger said “in faith his tidings or prophesies would have been divinely given or instructed.”
A.E. Knoch in the Concordant Commentary on Hebrews 11, states, “Enoch, in order to believe God, had a special revelation. Jude quotes from his early prophecy. Though he walked with God, he evidently walked in the midst of a most ungodly generation, which, indeed, prepared the earth for the deluge. He registered his faith in the approaching judgment by naming his first born son Methuselah, whose name means: “when he is dead it shall be sent. The deluge came in the year of his son’s death.”
What is most often talked about in the case of Enoch is at Genesis 5:24 the CLV reads “And Enoch was not found for taken was he” also translated as “Enoch was translated as so not to see death” and this has been misinterpreted although untrue as to his being taken to live in heaven. As we read in Hebrews 11:13 which was written centuries later, after listing the faithful with Enoch named among them, it said, “In faith died all these not being requited with the promises”
So that tells us that Enoch died according to the account given in Hebrews 11 and IF, heaven had been promised him, of which there is no scriptural support for that, but in theory if it was, the scripture says he was not given the promise so how could he have been taken to live in heaven? There is another meaning to what was said about his being translated so as not to see death and which has been clouded over by the preconceived belief in the immortal soul and that the believer goes immediately to heaven at death.
So what else could that passage be referring to? Most likely since Enoch walked with God and in the role of a Prophet, he warned of the coming judgment from God on the world and on those sinning messengers. He would have been hated by Satan and others and so perhaps God moved him away from those who would want to kill him. It does not say God killed him but perhaps he was taken away to some place safe until he died. In the book of Enoch, he speaks of being taking someplace but was not dead and could still be communicated with by his family…having questions about the evil on the earth and the coming judgment.
We are told. his days numbered 365 which is a comparatively short life span in relation to the others of that time. God did not bring the judgment Enoch foretold while he lived so he was also kept from the impending judgment as was his firstborn son Methuselah, God waited until the year his son died. God also then, preserved his grandson Noah and family through the judgment which was the flood of Noah.
I can almost see that this as a type of the future judgment of which some saints will be removed before it comes, saints snatched away before the latter days begin and others will be sealed and preserved through it such as we read of the 144,000 in Revelation 7 and 14 and others protected from it, those who heed the gospels and the words of Jesus to flee to the wilderness when they see certain things happening in their land and they will be protected there.
In the context of the myth that teaches Enoch died and went to heaven lets look at another person that this is also said of by Christendom’s false teaching and belief in man having an immortal soul or spirit.
We might briefly refer to Elijah who it is also said, he is living in heaven with Enoch by Christendom as they point to 2 Kings 2:11 “And it came to pass as they (Elijah and Elisha) still went on, and talked, and behold there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.”
Yet we can read in 2 Chronicles 21:12 that Elijah wrote to King Jehoram which scholars say was 20 years after the account in 2 Kings 2:11. But if that is not enough we can also refer to the Apostle John’s words at John 3:13 “No man has ascended into heaven except He who has descended.” speaking of His lord Jesus Christ.
Also our own Apostle Paul states of Jesus Christ “Who alone has immortality, making His home in light inaccessible, whom not one of mankind perceived nor can be perceiving…” 1 Timothy 6:16 So be it!
The Nephilim, the second irruption in the land of Canaan because it was promised to Abraham.
If some of the angels in the days of Adam down to Noah left their habitation and took mortal women as wives and if at the flood they were all locked away, the question is then asked in regards to the reference to them in Numbers and Deuteronomy. If the messengers did it once why couldn’t other angels under Satan’s influence do the same thing again? This is what Bullinger meant when he spoke of as “a second irruption.”
At Numbers 13:33 we find a reference to the Nephilim again: “And there we saw the giants, (Hebrew Nephilim) the sons of Anak, which comes of the giants; (Nephilim) and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers and so were we in their sight.” There are also other scriptures speaking of, other clans related to these Nephilim also said to be giants who were living in the land of Canaan when Israel arrives there to take possession of it as Jehovah instructed.
So lets explore that phrase in Verse 4 next….there were Nephilim in the land and also after that…they were in the land before the flood and also after the flood…..The CLV “As for the distinguished they were on the earth in those days and also afterward when the sons of the elohim were coming to the daughters of the human and they gave them offspring. They were the masterful ones, who were from the eon, mortals of renown.”
Even the Concordant rendering…hints at the literal view, why use offspring when in all the other genealogical accounts given it was always said that they begat sons and daughters…? And why were their offspring said to be masterful, and men of renown?
Bullinger explains the second irruption by going back in time to when Jehovah called Abram from the city of Ur. God told Abram to leave that city and go to a land that he would give him and his descendants. Several times Jehovah shows him the land and tells him that his seed will own that land and that land was Canaan. The phrase and after that…Genesis 6:4 links to Israel taking possession of their promised land.
In the Numbers 13 the account of the spies Moses sent into the land and they came back terror stricken and said we are as grasshoppers in comparison to the inhabitants of the land of Canaan. We need to refresh our memories of many of the Old Testament stories we learned as children. Were the Israelites cowards or were the inhabitants of the land of Canaan the giants spoken of in Genesis 6 and if so…how do we explain this since weren’t they destroyed in the flood?
Yes they were, as all flesh died, but if indeed the account is accurate that they were the offspring of the union of angels and women…that could happen again as the sinning messengers would not have drowned in the flood they had the power to removed themselves either by leaving the earth or the human body they had assumed. And even if the sinning messengers were all locked away in Tartarus as Jude 6 suggests…more of Satan’s messengers could have again left their estate as those in the days of Noah had.
Why would they do this you might ask? Was it not Satan’s role as the adversary to interfere with God’s will and purpose for creating humanity? The whole purpose of the first irruption was to stop the promised seed from coming forth from Adam and Eves line….the one which will crush Satan and his followers. That land was promised by Jehovah to Abraham in Genesis 12:1-3 and 13:14-17
At Genesis 15:5 Abram is told that “his seed shall be as the unnumbered as the stars of heaven.” His name is changed at Genesis 17:5 and at Verses7, 8 the promise is given again “And I will establish My covenant between Me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee and to thy seed after thee. And I will give unto thee, and to they seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession and I will be their God.”
The adversary hearing the promises given to Abram….knowing his was the line for the promised seed promised in Genesis to Eve and of his demise but it. Now hears the promise given to Abraham by Jehovah through his seed will come the blessing all families of the earth, in other words, redeeming humanity, from sin and death.
Jehovah was in a covenant relationship with Abraham even before Israel was formed and before the Law covenant established with Israel. That promised seed of Genesis 3:15 to be the redeemer for humanity, and so obviously any who Jehovah chose to use to fulfill that promise would be the target of the Adversary, seeking to interfere with God’s Plan.
So the adversary, first targeted humanity and then he targeted the chosen nation and then individuals in that nation all in an attempt to prevent the promised seeds arrival. Later he would target Jesus as a babe he tried to have him killed by Herod and he tried to get Him to sin during His ministry and when it appears Satan has won as Jesus dies on the cross…but instead he unknowingly and unwillingly participated in Gods will for the promised seed to redeem humanity was accomplished by the very death, Satan sought!
We need to always open our minds and expand our thinking into the realm of the spirit world, which we cannot see nor are we equal too, but we are being used by God to reveal to them just Who the Most High God is. Does that sound strange to you? Just because they live in the celestials as does Jehovah that does not mean that they know Him in the full extent that they will when this is all over with they too are learning good and evil by God using flesh and blood to humble the spirit realm.
From the time that the first promise was made to Abram, Genesis 12:1 until the Exodus from Egypt of the Israelites was 430 years. Moses and the Israelites wandered in the wilderness for another 40 years and when they arrived at the borders of the land promised to them, the land of Canaan, that land was already inhabited by large clans of men, the Nephilim and their descendants. Numbers 13:23? The cities were huge…with high walls…do you remember the story of Jericho…the king of Oz, Goliath? By the measurements given of that time…Goliath was about 13 feet tall!
Why would normal men need such huge tall cities and there are said to have been 60 of these cities under the King Oz? At that time they only fought on foot and or horses of which it was only the wealthy that had horses, camels and donkeys.
Today there are remains of the city of Bashan…a city whose height far exceeds any needed by normal humans…also there are many other unexplainable remains of buildings with stones so huge no one has yet figured out how normal humans could have erected them all around the world? Also there is the still unexplained Pyramids how did humans before the wheel was invented build such mathematical precise structures besides the immense weight of the stones used? There is much more intriguing information about these pyramids which I will add at the end of this study.
This brings us again to the first prophecy given by God at Genesis 3:15.
Genesis 3:15 “And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her Seed; It shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise His heel.” KJAV I though we would also place here the Concordant translation of this verse and how the Jewish Study Bible translates it. CLV “And enmity am I setting between you and the woman, and between your seed and her seed. He shall hurt your head and you shall hurt his heel.” Also the JSB “I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; they shall strike at your head, and you shall strike at their heel.”
Who or what are the seed of the Adversary? Our first answer is of course….all those who are deceived by him and led by him to also oppose Gods will and purpose. We have many scriptural proofs for this. So these would be his seed in a figurative or spiritual arena and I find no scriptural passages which tell me directly…they are the seed spoken of in Genesis 3:15.
We need to go further into motive being more that the mere coveting of women…and to the purpose of Satan in is role as “the adversary” which is and has always been to thwart God’s purpose for mankind which was as He commanded them to do, to multiply and fill the earth…..and the promised seed, the redeemer and the one to crush Satan.
Hebrews 2:14 and 1 John 3:8 Bullinger’s notes says the seed is in the singular and would apply to Christ and that is why the KJAV…capitalizes Seed. While Knoch did not capitalize seed…but the He shows us that it is a person who will bruise or crush the head of the adversary.
The Adversary by his very name can do nothing but plan how to thwart the next step in God’s plan to build the nation of Israel through which that SEED was to come. And so the and after that of Genesis 6:4 would be the second attempt or second irruption by more sinning messengers setting about to populate the land of Canaan promised to Israel with “his seed” in advance of Israel’s arrival as Satan took heed of the promises given to Abram and repeated when Jehovah changed his name to Abraham and the promised child was born.
Genesis 12:6,7 “Abram is in the plains of Moreh (and the Canaanite was then in the land.).And the LORD appeared unto Abram, and said, Unto thy seed will I give this land;” Bullinger’s notes on this passage, “The place of Abram’s first altar and also of Jacob’s altar, 33:18. Canaanite….then in the land. It is evident that from Terah’s and Abrams call, Satan knew the line by which “the seed of the woman” Genesis 3:15 was coming into the world.
In Chapter 6 he aimed at the whole human race. Now he aims at Abraham and his land. Here is the second explanation of the words “after that” in Genesis 6:4. He pre occupies the territory ready to dispute the advance. The Canaanite “was then” …. “being already” there, Genesis 13:7. The progeny of the later attempt to corrupt the race had to be destroyed by the sword of Israel, as those “in the days of Noah” had been by the Flood.”
Genesis 13:7 “the Canaanite and Perizzite dwelled then in the land” Bullinger’s notes say “these were the Nephilim. See Appendix 23, 25.” Perhaps the real reason, Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed by fire as he also says, “Gomorrah means…People of Fear.” These were cities also built and occupied by the second irruption of giants born to more sinning messenger’s cohabitating with women, but who would have sex with all flesh….men and animals. This is documented in the secular records of many countries dating back to that era as well as of cannibalism in that part of the world….not just Africa as I had thought.
In Genesis 17:8 Abraham is again show the land and the promised repeated. “And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting (eonian) possession; and I will be their (Abrahams seed) God.”
Also affirmed to Jacob, Isaacs son Genesis 48:3 “And Jacob said unto Joseph, God Almighty appeared unto me at Luz in the land of Canaan and blessed me. And said unto me, behold I will make thee fruitful and multiply thee, and I will make of thee a multitude of people; and will give this land to they see after thee for an everlasting (eonian) possession.”
Jehovah gave these promises to Abraham approximately 470 years before Joshua took Israel across the Jordan and into that land. Bullinger points out that Satan as the adversary is always ready to thwart Gods plans and so he had plenty of time to see to it that his seed, a corrupted form of humans, the second irruption of Nephilim or giants would occupy that land before Abrahams seed would arrive.
So as in the days before the flood and as Genesis 6:4 said “there were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that”…after the flood, more sinning messengers cohabited with women and their children once again would have been very large and violent warriors and this would be the reason why Jehovah gave instructions for the Israelites “to utterly destroy, the Hittites, the Amorites, the Canaanites and the Perizzites, the Hivites, the Jebusites” According to Bullinger’s notes and scripture these were clans of giants… the Nephilim. According to Knoch’s interpretation, these would have been clans of the distinguished….the firstborn sons of Seth….and this does not make sense or add up at all!
Judges 13:12 “All the kingdom of Og in Bashan, which reigned in Ashtaroth and in Edrei, who remained of the remnant of the giants: for these did Moses smite and cast them out” (giants from the name Rephaim another branch of the Nephilim, called so after one Rapha as Anakim from Anak.)
But Israel did not always obey explicitly and it would seem some of the Nephilim survived and are spoken of at Joshua 13:13 16,10 and Judges 1:28-34
So we ask the question, were the Nephilim what Jehovah was referring to when he said to Satan, there would be enmity between the woman’s seed and your seed, you will bruise His heel, but He will crush your head…” The literal seed of Satan and the sinning messengers, taking the daughters of Adam for wives and who bore their children or offspring the seed of Satan?
If the Nephilim were a mixture of angelic beings and mortals it would be understandable as to why Jehovah made the statement of regretting or was saddened at having made man because of what was befalling humanity at the hands of Satan and the sinning messengers intent on the corruption of Adams lineage and of the wickedness of these ungodly offspring and this was why it was necessary to make a judgment and bring the flood in order to eliminate this race coming from the union of the sons of the Alueim and the daughters of men or of the man, Adam, ha-adham.
We must keep our minds open also to their corrupting all flesh, the animals, birds and water creatures...I know this is hard to visualize but if we review the gods of Egypt especially…as there are numerous drawings of their gods on the walls of the pyramids and temples and similar drawing found in temples all around the world.
These thousands of drawings show, half animal, half human gods, humans with heads of a bird or crocodile and many other variations. Also in these drawings the gods tower over the normal humans and also show them to be blood thirsty, killing or accepting sacrifices of babies. Humans on their own would not have decided they needed to offer their own babies and children to an imaginary god. That practice was begun out of fear engendered by the spirit beings who were far superior and powerful than they.
These fallen messengers each have names which seem to be patterned after the stars in the heavens and thus one of the reasons they are referred to as stars in scripture. These are just some of the primitive truths behind the religions and legends which are still in existence today in every culture on this planet yet today. The followers of those religions do not need to see those gods, from birth they are taught to believe the religion of their parents and ancestors. This is what is meant by the words…the whole world lies in the power of the wicked one 1 John 5:19 and Satan is the god of this world. 2 Corinthians 4:4
If you are like me, we just always assumed these gods of mythology were a product of the imagination of men….but were they? Keep in mind…that God deemed all flesh, worthy of destruction in the flood of Noah and to repeat myself again, why would the dumb animals be punished for mans evil?
I think if we stop thinking of Gods judgments as being vindictive punishment for sin but instead as a process of cleansing…purification, all leading to eventual reconciliation…we might have a better view of His use of them throughout the eons.
We read of the Nephilim that the spies saw, let’s look at that passage again in Numbers 13:33 “there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, whom come of the Nephilim.” How, it may be asked, could this be, if they were all destroyed in the Flood? The answer is in Genesis 6:4 where we read: “There were Nephilim in the earth in those days (the days of Noah) and also AFTER That, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became the mighty men (Hebrew is gibbor, the heroes, not as the use of the word in our day) which were of old, men of renown: (literally men of the name, i.e. who got a name and were renowned for their ungodliness).
Lets look at Bullinger’s notes on this again….”So that “after that”, i.e. after the Flood, there was a second irruption of these fallen angels, evidently smaller in number and more limited in area, for they were for the most part confined to Canaan, and were in fact known as “the nations of Canaan” It was for the destruction of these, that the sword of Israel was necessary, as the Flood had been before.”
“As to the date of this second irruption, it was evidently soon after it became known that the seed was to come through Abraham; for when he came out from Haran Genesis 12:6 and entered Canaan, the significant fact is stated: “The Canaanite was then (i.e. already) in the land.” And in Genesis 14:5 they were already known as “Rephaim” and “Emim” and had established themselves at Ashteroth Karnaim and Shaveh Kirathaim”
“In Genesis 15:18-21 they are enumerated and named among Canaanite People: “Kenites and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites, and the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims, and the Amorites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites” Exodus 3:8, 17; 23:23. Deuteronomy 7:20. 17. Joshua 12:8”
“These were to be cut off, and driven out, and utterly destroyed. Deuteronomy 20:17; Joshua 3:10; But Israel failed in this. Joshua 13:134; 15:63; 16:10; 17:18. Judges 1:19,20, 28,29, 30-36 and we know not how many got away to other countries to escape the general destruction. If this were recognized, it would go far to solve many problems connected with Anthropology.”
“As to their other names, they were called Anakim, from one Anak which came of the Nephilim Numbers 13:23 and Rephaim, from Rapha, another notable one among them. From Deuteronomy 2:10, they were known by some as Emim and Horim, and Zamzummim Verses 20,21 and Avim, &c.”
This would also perhaps explain Goliath the giant of the Philistine army that David slew, it seem that giant was the only one in that army and this would be an example of Israel not following instructions as they should have and all were not killed in the cities this fighting delayed the establishment of Israel and the building of a permanent temple for their God Jehovah to dwell in. David was used to clean the land and prepare it for his son Solomon to build the permanent temple and for a time Israel then prospered.
Now I have read that it is said the Nephilim were a hybrid race but that word is not found in the scriptures about them…but others assuming angels are a different species from humans surmise this. Hybrids are said to not able to procreate or if so for only one generation. In the accounts given in Numbers and Deuteronomy it sounds like…some of these clans of people that God told Israel to utterly wipe out…are said to be the descendants of the Nephilim…and so this would indicate procreation.
My research shows that hybrids are able to reproduce and in this case, the sinning messengers having powers we do not understand but they understanding humanity could have altered DNA for their own use.
Are not the scientists of today…able to artificially inseminate life in the womb …and are they not able to clone…produce an animal from one cell and it is known they have the ability to do this with humans; they have not done yet, as the laws are against it. I also read, they have the technology to genetically program a child, called a designer child and also working on a technique for a barren mother to have someone else’s egg implanted with her own personal genetic data, making that child hers! But the point being with this information on what inferior humans have figured out in our day, I think it rather naive to not suppose this would have also been the knowledge and abilities of the superior beings, the gods, eons ago!
We also have Genesis 24:3 and 28:1 to look at….I got curious the more I studied this subject and how Israel were told to kill everyone in certain cities and not in others and then I noticed how Abraham made Isaac swear to not take a wife from the daughters of the Canaanites…and Isaac passed that same restriction onto his son Jacob, “And Isaac called Jacob, and blessed him and charged him, and said unto him, Thou shalt not take a wife of the daughters of Canaan.”
I began to wonder, was there any other time when they were told not to marry certain ones before the nation was formed? I could not find any and so I wondered if the Nephilim had anything to do with these things and also when Israel was sometimes told by Jehovah to put their foreign wives away and other times some were killed?
So this brings us to the question…..could the angels marry mortal women and produce children and if so could those children marry and procreate…? It is said the children would be hybrids and usually they can only reproduce once. The definition of a hybrid is the offspring of when two different species mate. But what if Alexander Thomson was correct, he puts forth in his article that the messengers and humanity are the same species.
Alexander Thomson believed angels and humans are of the same species, the difference between the two is a soulish body and a spiritual body…as we discussed messengers are also said to be men and have the human form. The difference being they have a spiritual body and humanity has a soulish body made of flesh….and yet God is in the process of making man in His image or as Genesis said, Let Us be making man in Our image….which the finished product will be when humanity has been changed from the soulish fleshly body to the spiritual body
I once attended a lecture given by a Christian who was also a physicist scientist who talked on the passage in 1 Timothy 6:13-16 “I am charging you in the sight of God, Who is vivifying all, and of Jesus Christ, Who testifies in the ideal avowal before Pontius Pilate, that you keep this precept unspotted, irreprehensible, unto the advent of our Lord, Christ Jesus, which, to its own ears, the happy and only Potentate will be showing: He is King of kings and Lord of Lord, Who alone has immortality, making His home in light inaccessible, Whom not one of mankind perceived nor can be perceiving, to Whom be honor and might eonian! Amen!”
In his lecture, he talked about light inaccessible for humans in our mortal state and also stated that the change we will experience from a human body to that of a spirit body was a very slight change in the atoms or molecules. I don’t remember the scientific details only that at the time I found it very interesting, that change that he described as being slight…a sort of tweaking of our atoms and molecules?
This is certainly something to consider…..it fits more with our accurate understanding of humanity being living souls, mortal but who are promised to be given new immortal bodies, spiritual bodies. While Christendom ever in error….teaches, that we are already an immortal spirit clothed in flesh.
In going back to when Israel was first entering the land let look at Deuteronomy 2 this is an interesting chapter to read as we see Jehovah giving instructions in Verses 1,2 “not to meddle with the people of Seir as they are the descendants of Esau. They could purchase food and water from them.” Verse 9 “And the LORD said unto me, Distress not the Moabites, neither contend with them in battle; for I will not give thee of their land for possession; because I have given Ar unto the children of Lot for a possession.”
Now in Deuteronomy 2:10,11 we read “The Emim (terrible ones of Genesis 14:5 a race of the Nephilim) dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakim; which also were accounted giants, as the Anakim; but the Moabites called them Emims”
So the Moabites had cleaned their land of these giants…which they had named them the Emims…the terrible ones. Verse 12 “The Horims also dwelt in Seir before time; (another race or name of the Nephilim) but the children of Esau succeeded them, when they had destroyed them from before them and dwelt in their stead; as Israel did unto the land of his possession which the LORD gave unto them.”
So Esau’s descendents cleared their land of these giants. If it were not for Bullinger’s research and notes we would not know who these people were. This information can also be found in many other sources such as Josephus the historian who also wrote of these giants which plagued Israel.
The next Verses 13-23 seem to go back and explain more of the LORD destroying the clans of giants from the land given to Esau and Lot. Verse 20 “That also was accounted a land of giants: giants dwelt therein in old time;”
What follows is list of names given to these clans of giants or that had giants living among them. “The Ammonites call these giants Zamzummim;…meaning noisy ones. Who were a people great and many and tall as the Anakim; but the LORD destroyed them before them;” In the land He gave to Esau and Lots children, “He destroyed the Horims…and the Avims, (another name for these Nephilim, Joshua 13:3) the Caphtorims.” (Another name from those who came out of Caphtor. Genesis 10:14, Amos 9:7, Jeremiah 47:4 sometimes identified with Crete or the Delta.)
So in Deuteronomy 2 Israel is on their way to the land promised to them and they are passing by the land given to Esau and Lot and Jehovah is telling them how He helped them to clear their land of the giants and most likely was meant to prepare them for the giants they will find in their land and which will need to be exterminated. The rest of the chapter summarizes up who they were told to kill and who they were told to give a warning to move out of the land and of those who fought them. Then they head to Bashan.
There is also an interesting story in Deuteronomy 3 Jehovah sent the Israelites into the city of Bashan, Verses 5,6 “All these cities were fenced with high walls, gates and bars, beside unwalled towns a great many, And we utterly destroyed them as we did unto Sihon King of Heshbon, utterly destroying the men, women and children of every city.”
Now, note Verse 11 “For only Og king of Basham remained of the remnant of giants; behold his bedstead was a bedstead of iron; is it not in Rabbath of the children of Ammon? Nine cubits was the length thereof and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man.)”
Bullinger’s notes point again to “the word giant... from the Hebrew Rephaim…descendants of Rapha….a branch of the Nephilim.” The size of this bed is given and we can get an idea of its largeness by the use of a cubit which can vary, but basically from 18 to 25 inches which would make this bed or couch between 18 and 25 feet long and 4 or 5 feet wide! Some wonder if this was his literal bed or a funeral couch used as a coffin as it is the same size of the coffin of Marduk a god of Babylon. No doubt Marduk was an actual spirit being which appeared to these people and that is why they began to worship him. But the point being is that this scripture said Og was a remnant of the giants….remnant meaning a part of the whole.
In my research I found lots of interesting articles related to this subject of giants…and archeologists have found swords which weigh 25 lbs…and armor designed for very large men and footprints preserved which are 18 to 25 inches in length. The stories of these giants, are all about how evil and blood thirsty warriors they were and these stories are found in every culture of the world….described by size and warfare cannibalism, also drawings have been found of very large men fighting smaller men.
The stories of mythology all have a theme running through them of gods, spirit beings coming from heaven and interacting with humans…filled with lust for sex and war. There are also numerous accounts in archeology of very large skeletal remains found in ancient graves all over the world…ranging in size from 7 to 14 feet. I cannot prove these stories as authentic but will place some of the information I did find at the end of this article.
So in getting back to the reason for the flood of Noah’s day, as stated, it was to wipe off all flesh because it had become corrupted….it would seem logical that the sinning messengers corrupting the lineage of Adam to prevent the promised seed from coming and required the extreme measures dictated by Jehovah with the flood and later when Israel entered the land also promised to Abraham.
These seemingly extreme measures in the Old Testament giving Him the reputation of a blood thirsty, vengeful God are hard to understand in relation to a God of love. But, if there was a second irruption, of these Nephelim again corrupting humanity and waiting for Israel’s arrival into the Promised Land, the Israelites would need protection from that corruption as it was the nation to bring forth the promised seed, Jesus Christ, the corrupt seed of Satan would need to be destroyed
I thought it would be could to review the list made by Bullinger on all the times Satan interfered with humanity in order to thwart Gods promises and purpose.
Bullinger’s list of Satan’s interference. From Appendix 23, The Companion Bible
Genesis 6:1-4 in response to Genesis 3:15. “This irruption of fallen angels was Satan first attempt to prevent the coming of the Seed of the woman foretold in Genesis 3:15. If this could be accomplished, Gods Word would have failed, and his own doom would be averted.
As soon as it was made know that the Seed of the woman was to come through Abraham, there must have been another irruption, as recorded in Genes 6:4 “and also after that” (i.e. after the days of Noah, more than 500 years after the first irruption).
The aim of the enemy was to occupy Canaan in advance of Abraham and so to contest its occupation by his seed. For when Abraham entered Canaan, we read at Genesis 123:6, “the Canaanite was then or already) in the land.”
In the same cheaper, Genesis 12:10-20 we see Satan’s next attempt t interfere with Abrahams seed and frustrate the purpose of God that it should be in “Isaac”. This attempt was repeated in Genesis 20: 1-18.
This great conflict may be seen throughout the Bible and it forms a great and important subject of Biblical study.. In each case the human instrument had his own personal interest to serve, while Satan had his own great object in view. Hence God had, in each case, to interfere and avert the evil and the danger of which His servants and people were wholly ignorant. The following assaults of the great Enemy stand out prominently”
The destruction of the chosen family by famine…Genesis 50:20
The destruction of the male line in Israel, Exodus 1:10, 15 Exodus 2:5, Hebrews 11:23.
The destruction of the whole nation in Pharaohs pursuit, Exodus 14.
After David’s line was singled out 2 Samuel 7, that was the next selected for assault. Satan’s first assault was in the union of Jehoram and Athaliah by Jehosaphat, not withstanding, 2 Chronicles 17:1. Jehoram killed off all his brothers. 2 Chronicles 21:4
The Arabians slew all his children, except Ahaziah, 2 Chronicles 21:17 and 22:1.
When Ahaziah died, Athaliah killed “all the seed royal” 2 Chronicles 22:10. The babe Joash alone was rescued; and for six years, the faithfulness of Jehovah word was at stake. 2 Chronicles 23:3.
Hezekiah was childless when a double assault was made by the King of Assyria and the king of Terrors. Isaiah 36:1, 38:1. God’s faithfulness was appealed to and relied on. Psalms 136.
In Captivity, Haman was used to attempt the destruction of the whole nation. Esther 3:6, 12,13. 6:1.
Josephs fear was worked on Matthew 1:18-20. Not withstanding the fact that he was “a just man” and kept the Law, he did not wish to have Mary stoned to death. Deuteronomy 24:1; hence Joseph determined to divorce. But God intervened. “Fear not”
Herod sought the young Childs life. Matthew 2.
At the Temptation, “Cast Thyself down was Satan’s temptation.
At Nazareth again. Luke 4, there was another attempt to cast Him down and destroy Him.
The two storms on the Lake were other attempts.
At length, the cross was reached and the sepulcher closed; the watch set; and the stone sealed.
But “God raised Him from the dead.” And now like another Joash, He is seated and expecting…Hebrews 10:12,13, hidden in the house of God on high and the members of the “one body” are hidden there in Him. Colossians 3:1-3, like another Jehoshaba; and going forth to witness of His coming like another Jehoiada. 2 Chronicles 23:3.
The irruption of the “fallen angels” sons of God was the first attempt and was directed against the whole human race.
When Abraham was called, then he and his seed were attacked.
‘When David was enthroned, then the royal line was assaulted.
And when the Seed of the woman” himself came, the storm bust upon Him.”
There is a lot of articles available for one to review which point to the beliefs of some of these ancient cultures and which it seems in all that I have read….they speak of these giants and of gods taking humans to wife and producing children…just as in these stories called myths… there are also creation accounts and a flood. As said earlier behind the origins of these myths is a primitive truth.
In a book written by John Gray, Near Eastern Mythology…he relates that “the Canaanite have a story of myth which tells of minor gods born from the union of El and human women. They used the term or name. .rup’um or dispensers of fertility.” So I think we must consider what these other cultures say when it agrees with scripture….not everyone through out the world would imagine the same stories….the origins all come from one place, time or event.
Here are a few more…The Book of Giants concerned with “the book of Enoch, said to be widely read in the Roman empire…in it the giants were believed to be the offspring of fallen angels…the Nephilim…also called the watchers…who married human women”
Also in that book…. “The name of one of the giants is Gilgamesh, the Babylonian hero and subject of a great epic written in the third millennium B.C.E.” In this book, the author gave another root spelling or derivative of “the name Nephilim in some ancient literature as nephel…saying this meant, untimely birth, abortion or miscarriage”
In Greece, “the legend is of a monstrous man-eating Cyclopes….said to be the true builders of walls of Tiryns, Mycenae and other ancient cities…built from huge blocks of stone.” Scholars speculate that this tradition of the giants born from the union of gods and humans formed the basis for the demigods of Greek mythology.” From the, The Watchers, by Raymond E. Fowler.
Bullinger said, “Thus the Babylonian “Creation Tablets” the Egyptian “Book of the dead”, the Greek mythology and heathen cosmogonies, which by some are set on an equality with Scripture, or by others adduced in support of it, are all the corruption and perversion of primitive truths, distorted in proportion as their origin was forgotten, and their memories faded away.”
Those of us who accept the literal viewpoint of Genesis 6:1-4 and the related scriptures speaking of the Nephilim base them as the primitive truth from which the other nations legends or myth’s began and so I have just given here are a sprinkling of the many, many, articles and research studies done on this subject, showing how the surrounding nations have had these similar legends, stories or myths.
Let’s now look at the scriptures which translated the name, Nephilim as not only, giants, but as the Rephaim, dead ones, dead things or deceased, and which in these passage it sounds like they are not to receive a resurrection. By not using the name in these passage, but speaking of the wicked not rising…have been used by those rejecting the salvation of all humanity from death and out of the dust of the ground. So I think it will be good to review these passages for ourselves.
The KJAV translators were in the habit of…interpreting scripture to fit the theology of the day instead of translating literally what was said in the original languages. This practice also allowed them to cover up things which they did not want to mislead the reader from established theology. Bullinger and Knoch and other men like them have tried to recapture what was lost because of this practice, we are indebted to them. But we must also remember they too had their preconceived theology and so do we and so we must continue to search for information to substantiate what others teach and even what we believe.
As I said earlier Bullinger has lots of information on the research he did on this subject in Appendixes 22-26 of the Companion Bible. In Appendix 25 we find his listing of the different words translated from nphl or Nephilim and the scriptures where they are found.
Giants…Genesis 6:4 and Numbers 23:33
The Rephaim 10 times with 2 in the margins. Genesis 14:5, 15:20, Joshua 12:15, margin. 2 Samuel 5:18, 22, 23:13, 1 Chronicles 11:15, 14:9, 20:4 margin Isaiah 17:5.
The dead, 7 times…Job 26:5, Psalms 88:10, Proverbs 2:18, 9:18, 21:16, Isaiah 14:8, 26:19
The Deceased….Isaiah 26:14, and in Verse 19 as the dead.
Also we find gibbor…defined as men of physical strength or mighty men in Appendix 14,iv, at Job 16:14
Some of these scriptures speak of some who are dead and will not rise again and according to Bullinger notes and others; this is in reference to the Nephilim but were instead translated as dead ones and deceased. In fact some will use these passages to discredit the salvation of all as they seem to imply there are some who will not rise again….yet as Bullinger points out, this cannot be in reference to humanity sired by Adam as the scriptures are clear that all humanity, descended from Adam will rise from the dust. We know Paul tells us this with these words, “all dead in Adam will be made alive in Christ”. 1 Corinthians 15:22,23
Another place with a strange verse that is referring to dead things is found in Job 26:5 “Dead things are formed from under the waters and the inhabitants thereof.” In the Companion Bible, Bullinger says “the Ellipsis must be supplied thus: (the place where the Rephaim stay which is beneath the waters and the things that are therein) this place thus answers to the other place, Sheol, the grave, in the next verse”
In the other rendering shown by Bullinger on how Job 26:5,6 should read as “Where stay the (mighty) Rephaim (of old)? Beneath the sea, and the things that are therein! (Open) before Him Sheol naked lies,” Those dead things or the mighty under the waters are not humans that have died because of the contrasting verse referring to Sheol where humans go at death…. Sheol means the unseen, the abode of the dead whether they are buried, burned up or drown.
The Concordant Version in this passage has Verse 5 reading, “The Rephaim, they travailed, those beneath the waters and tabernacling in them.” These passages speaking of the dead not rising and this seems to indicate some thing is living under the waters, the only explanation for this then would be the sinning messengers said to be kept bound in a cavernous place, Tartarous…by Peter and Knoch said that darkness is what they fear as perhaps sunlight is their source of life…..in like manner as human souls need food and water to live.
Bullinger said, the Rephaim were well known, and are often mentioned: but, unfortunately, instead of by their proper name, it was variously translated as “dead” “deceased” or “giants”.
In Bullinger’s notes, he said “these Rephaim are to have no resurrection as stated in Isaiah 26:14 where the proper name is rendered “deceased.” “They are dead, they shall not live; they are deceased, (they are Rephaim) they shall not rise: therefore hast Thou visited and destroyed them, and made all their memory to perish.” and Verse 19, where it is rendered “the dead” “Dead Things…Hebrew “The Rephaim” the offspring of the fallen angels akin to the Nephilim of Genesis 6:4 See Appendix 23 and 25 and the notes on Isaiah 26:14,19.”
In the footnotes at this passage, Bullinger state this…Verse 14 speaks of they…i.e. “other lords” taken from the Hebrew word methim…Not dead men, as such, for “all men shall rise again (Daniel 12:2; John 5:28,29; Acts 23: 6,8; 24:15; 1 Corinthians 15:22; Revelation 20:4-6,13) but those referred to in Verse 13, as the deceased=the Rephaim.
This is a proper name, and should not be translated otherwise. Where it is translated it is always rendered ‘giants or dead” Job 26:5. Psalms 88:10; Proverbs 2:18; 9:18; 21:16; Isaiah 14:9, in The sinning messengers who fathered these giants….are now in “chains” (2 Peter 2:4, Jude 6) “reserved” unto judgment; but their progeny will not rise Verses 14, 19 or be judged, for they have been “visited” “destroyed” and “perished” See Appendix 23 and 25.”
Verse 19 “Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead. His footnotes for Verse 19 are “Thy dead men = Thy dead ones. Hebrew, methim, as in Verse 14. These are very different from the dead in Verse 14. They are Jehovah’s dead. These shall rise. My dead body shall….arise = my corpse a noun of multitude). Shall they arise, a plural verb; i.e. all the dead bodies of Jehovah’s people.
All these shall awake and sing. Psalms 17:15 dwell in dust = lie in the dust; i.e. buried in the dust of the earth. As the dew of herbs = like the dew upon herbs: i.e. revivifying them. (Cp 66:14). cast out; or cast away. Not to yield up in resurrection. Whom will the earth, thus cast away? See the answer in the word which follows. the dead = the Rephaim, these “will not rise.”
As said above, that word Nephilim which is a proper name was rendered dead 7 times and also rendered deceased. It was retained as a proper name “Rephaim” ten times…two being in the margin. Genesis 14:5 15:20 Joshua 12:15 margin. 2 Samuel 5:18, 22; 23:13; 1 Chronicles 11:15; 14:9; 20:4 margin. Isaiah 17:5. (Can we see how truth is missed with bad translations?).
In all other places it is rendered “giants” Genesis 6:3; Numbers 23:33, where it should be, Nephilim; and Job 16:14 where it is gibbor….(Appendix 14, iv) which says mighty men at Genesis 6:4 having to do with physical strength while Enosh is used in respect to the nature of men being depraved..
Bullinger’s notes continue… “By reading all these passages the Bible student may know all that can be known about these beings. It is certain that the second irruption took place before Genesis 14, for there the Rephaim were mixed up with the five nations or peoples, which included Sodom and Gomorrah and were defeated by the four kings under Chedorlaomer. Their principal locality was evidently “Ashtaroth Karnaim”; while the Emim were in the plain of Kiriathaim. Genesis 14:5”
“Anak was a noted descendant of the Nephilim; and Rapha was another, giving their names respectively to different clans. Anak’s father was Arba, the original builder of Hebron (Genesis 35:27 Joshua 15:13; 21:11) and this Palestinian branch of the of the Anakim was not called Arabhim after him, but Anakim after Anak. They were great, mighty, and tall (Deuteronomy 2:10,11,21-23; 9:2, evidently inspiring the ten spies with great fear (Numbers 13:33) Og king of Basham is described in Deuteronomy 3:11”.
“Their strength is seen in “the giant cities of Bashan” today; and we know not how far they may have been utilized by Egypt in the construction of buildings, which is still an unsolved problem.”
“Arba was rebuilt by the Khabiri or confederates seven years before Zoan was built by the Egyptian Pharaohs of the nineteenth dynasty. Numbers 13:22 “And they ascended by the south and came unto Hebron; where Ahiman, Sheshai and Talmai, the children of Anak were. (Now Hebron was built seven years before Zoan in Egypt.)”
His notes on this passage are as follows. “south” = the negeb. Genesis 12:9 and 13:1 Hebron… Ancient name, Kirjath-arba (or stronghold of Arba) Genesis 23:2,19. because built by Anak and the sons Arba. Joshua 14:15; 15:13.”
“The Tel-el-Amarna Tablets show that certain bands of Hittite condottieri are called “Kharbiri”, or “allies” (hence the name Hebron, which means “confederacy” or friendship, which is not met with till Ramases II, captured Kirjath-Arba. Ebed-Tob, king of Jerusalem, see note on Genesis 14:18, in his letters to Pharaoh frequently mentions these Khabiri or confederates of Amorites and Hittites. God’s confederacy with His people in Christ was “before the foundation of the world.”
“Before Zoan the city of the wise was known, Ahiman…driven out by Caleb. Joshua 15:13.14. Slain by Judah. Judges 1:10. children of Anak = home born persons; usually of slaves. These were the result of a second irruption of the fallen angles. See Genesis 6:4, “after that”. These are “Nephilim” in Verse 33. See Appendixes 23 and 25.”
“The name “Anak” occurs here and in Verses 28, 33, Deuteronomy 9:2 and Joshua 15:14 built: i.e. rebuilt (banah) frequently has this meaning). Joshua 6:26 1Kings 16:34 2 Kings 14: 22 Isaiah 44:28, Amos 9:14 (Seven years before Zoan in Egypt). Built by the first kings of the nineteenth dynasty. See Appendix 37. Ramases II made it his capital, Isaiah 30:4 (and is the first to mention Hebron) Zoan was the scene of the Exodus….see Psalms 78: 12,13 and the “house of bondage”. Zoan see notes on Exodus 1:10”
Bullinger continues…“If these Nephilim and their branch of Rephaim, were associated with Egypt, we have an explanation of the problem which has for ages perplexed all engineers, as to how those huge stones and monuments were brought together. Why not in Egypt as well as in “the giant cities of Bashaun” which exist, as such, to this day?” Even today, no explanation has been found for how this city was built and why its doorways and homes are so huge.
“Moreover, we have in these mighty men, the “men of renown” the explanation of the origin of the Greek mythology. That mythology was no mere invention of the human brain, but it grew out of the traditions, and memories and legends of the doings of that mighty race of beings; and was gradually evolved out of the “heroes” of Genesis 6:4. The fact that they were supernatural in their origin formed an easy step to their being regarded as the demi-gods of the Greeks.”
Again to repeat Bullinger’s closing comments on Appendix 25, “Thus the Babylonian “Creation tablets”. The Egyptian “Book of the dead”, the Greek mythology, and heathen Cosmogonies, which by some are set on an equality with Scripture, or by others adduced in support of it, are all the corruption and perversion of primitive truths, distorted in proportion as their origin was forgotten, and their memories faded away.”
Let look at a few more passages which imply, the Nephilim will not rise again.
Isaiah 43:17 “Which bringeth forth the chariot and horse, the army and the power; “they shall lie down together, they shall not rise: they are extinct, they are quenched as tow.” (Tow is a wick made of flax, for a candle?)
Psalms 1:4, 5 “The ungodly are not so; But are like the chaff which the wind driveth away. Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, Nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.” Look also at: Deuteronomy 33:11; 2 Samuel 22:38, 39;
We then must compare these with the statements that show all the dead will be raised, Revelation 20:5,6;
Daniel 12:1,2; 1 Corinthians 15:21-26 and let’s read the words of Psalms 88:10 “Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? Shall the dead arise and praise thee? Shall Thy loving kindness be declared in the grave? Or thy faithfulness in destruction? Shall thy wonders be known in the dark? And Thy righteousness in the land of forgetfulness? The dead in this passage is the Rephaim and of Job 26:24, 19. Bullinger’s notes indicate he did not believe they would receive a resurrection.
It seems to me that the writer is emphasizing that in death and destruction there is no glory for God but it is in the raising of the dead and the making of all things new….God will be glorified.
I also wonder if these passages in the Hebrew Scriptures written by and for Israel in relation to their dealings with the giants, Nephelim or their descendants the Rephaim, among the ungodly nations….who were without God at that time as only the favored nation had Jehovah and so they speak of them in death having no hope. But all that changed when Christ died on the cross or stake for all.
Now since we know that all the dead have been purchased by His blood and belong to Him and both evangels tell us that each in their own class or order will rise out of the dust, some to life eonian and some to judgment. The scriptures are plain and simple on this fact that all will be resurrected but I have not completely satisfied my mind on what Bullinger believed…about the Nephilim not rising from the dust.
We know he did not believe in Hellfire…but did he believe in the salvation of all…it does not seem so as it seems he believed in the annihilation of the wicked….if this is true then it is logical he would place the wicked offspring, the Nephilim within that view of the wicked which are annihilated.
So because of his theology I am not sure if Bullinger’s assessment of the offspring of the sinning messengers not receiving a resurrection. If we believe all humanity will be raised from the dead and that all spirit beings, which means all the sinning messengers, including Satan himself will be reconciled to God eventually and if the literal view of Genesis 6:1-4 is correct, the offspring or children were half human and half sprit beings why would they not be saved and reconciled also?
We learned that humanity is of the race or kin of God being His creation and being made into His image, why then would they not also be raised from the dead? I suspect the passages of scriptures which speak of their not rising again were meant in the relative viewpoint or human viewpoints and meant as comfort to the Israelites who were in fear of these men, perhaps knowing they were the offspring of sinning spirit beings worried them in that they would not stay dead but that these fearsome men as giants would come back to plague them again as they had done in the past is what prompted these words.
I did read another article in which the author put forth the thought based on the absoluteness of the salvation of all and the reconciliation of the entire Universe by his looking to Revelation 20:12, the great and small standing before the Great White throne…the writer felt the great would be the Nephilim? So as we can see there is a lot to think about on this subject gendered by the four verses in Genesis 6 which prompted this review and study and I for one cannot dismiss it so simply as a mere myth.
Perhaps the words of Paul should be reviewed again at Philippians 2:9-11 “that in the name of Jesus every knee should be bowing, celestial and terrestrial and subterranean, and every tongue should be acclaiming that Jesus Christ is Lord, for the glory of God the Father.”
So these versus speaking of the Nephilim and the Rephaim not rising again are either speaking in a symbolic or figurative way as the evil warriors that they were and who instilled fear into everyone around them, which as such, they in that evil state, would not be back again to plague humanity. I am not sure if we can find the answer to this, so I can only say what we know, and that the sinning messengers were or are confined in Tartarus awaiting their time of judging…remember that word means to set right.
Their imprisonment has been punishment…if they are sons of God as each was a direct creation as we learned from scriptures; we know that they are going to be reconciled to God. They were the perpetrators and will be reconciled to their Creator and so what of their offspring…could we not say they as well as humanity were the victims?
The children would have been part human and part spirit men, yes they were wicked but are they not part of the creation of humanity through their human mothers? I find it hard to think they too will not be healed and reconciled….so these are some things to wonder about, and add to the list of questions probably will not be answered until we are with the Lord and so let’s continue through the rest of these passages.
Now let’s also look briefly at Spirits, Angels, and Demons in the scriptures.
At this point in our discussion I also thought I would add here something else to the equation, some things I wonder if somehow fits here. In the scriptures we have many different names identifying spirit beings living in the celestial realms, invisible to our eyes. Angels, Messengers, Cherubim, Seraphim, men in the Old Testament and Paul describes several classes of beings in the New Testament as Sovereignty’s, authorities, world mights of this darkness, the spiritual forces of wickedness among the celestials. Ephesians 6:10-13
Paul also speaks of thrones, dominions, principalities and powers in Colossians 1:16, Ephesians 1:21 and 3:10 as well as those we have a spiritual warfare with in Ephesians 6.
We need to understand that there are levels or cast systems for these spirit beings…probably if we compare them to our human society, Kings, with their priests or Presidents with their cabinet…Senators Congressmen, on down to Governors, Mayors. Remember names and titles…depict an office or work.
When Adam and Eve were evicted from Eden, Jehovah placed, “the cherubims at the entrance to the garden….with flaming swords” to prevent them or anyone to get back into that garden. Those cherubim were visible to humans!! Genesis 3:24 Just because you and I have never seen a cherubim or a messenger or any other of the vast multitude of spirit life in that realm does not mean they do not exist or that in ancient times…those people did see them. All the evidence in scripture does support that they did.
Jehovah spoke to Adam and Eve and to Cain when he was jealous of his brother Able. Jehovah spoke to Enoch and Noah and after the flood to Abram, Isaac and Jacob. Jehovah spoke to Moses and Joshua as well as the judges and prophets He used. Also on many occasions and He gave dreams and interpretations to others, such as Joseph, Daniel and Ezekiel among others.
A visit by a messenger is said to have been an apparition or theophanies, we are given the account of when the angel Gabriel in Luke 1:11-20 visits the priest Zechariah to tell him of the coming birth of Jesus and that his older wife would also have a son….Zechariah because of his fear and disbelief was struck mute…until the birth of his son…which was John the Baptist the forerunner of the ministry of Jesus.
At Luke 1:26-33 Gabriel also visited with Miriam to tell her she would become pregnant with the Son of the Most High. Miriam saw and talked with him, Verses 34-38. Joseph was given a dream in which a messenger told him to not divorce Mary, Matthew 1:19-25 and later, a messenger appeared to men tending their flocks followed by their witnessing heavenly hosts singing and praising God. Luke 2:8-14.
When Christ appeared to his followers on several occasions after his resurrection…we are told it was in different forms…because sometimes he was not immediately recognized and he could appear and vanish at will. Mark 16:12. He also had them touch his body and said….a spirit does not have flesh and bones. Yet would we not say that He had a spirit body…which was immortal? John 20:26-29
He said he had flesh and bone…what was gone was the blood. But keep in mind the disciples were familiar with spirits who had no bodies and possessed humans making them physically and mentally ill and these spirits are said to be the demons. They were also aware that messengers appeared as men as the writer of Hebrews 13:1,2 states. So, when Jesus appeared to them, He was reassuring them of Who He was and that He was not a spirit tricking them.
The body He was in then was would seem to fit what Paul called “the terrestrial glory” in which those of Israel will be given when they are resurrected to rule and reign with Him in the kingdom on earth? A body suitable for living on the earth yet will be vivified or immortal. While He made a change when He returned to heaven taking back the glory He had before the world was and in that glory He appeared to Saul of Tarsus and that glory literally blinded Saul. That is the celestial glory those in the Body of Christ will be given at the snatching away. That is the celestial glory of which the bodies of the saints called to heaven will be given suitable for the celestial realms and dealing with the celestial beings living in this vast Universe.
Matthew 9:34 and 12:24 speaks of a Chief of Demons Daniel 10:13 speaks of the prince of Persia who for 21 days prevented the messenger sent to bring Daniel an answer to his prayer and Michael came to his assistance. All governments are under Satan; Paul tells us he is the god of this world. 2 Corinthians 4:4 So Satan has a chief or prince over each government in the world as well as those who perpetuate religious error in every religion of the world no matter how benign it seems…. even Christendom. Is it any wonder a believer should distance themselves from politics and religion?
My point being in the celestial realm we are going to find many different descriptions of beings with just as many abilities. What Paul teaches and what we are promised in the new administration is a change from a soulish body to a spiritual and not that at death we become disembodied souls or spirits wafting around in heaven waiting for a reunion with our body as Christendom teaches. Paul said our bodies will be changed from mortal human bodies to immortal spirit bodies….we then will enter the realm which the angels now occupy. So back to my question, who are those said to be spirits with no bodies?
Lets see what Knoch had to say about them, if we go to Pages 71, 72 of the Keyword Concordance in the back of the Concordant Literal Version there is quite a list of scriptures to read, please do this on your own, I will put a couple here but also take note of what the definition of Demon is, which is, teach…! Giving a little more clarification to Paul’s words…..the doctrines of demons at 1 Timothy 4:1
Doesn’t the definition, teach or hint at their involvement with humanity…. teachers of lies, false doctrine, deceiving and leading man away from Jehovah. In many passages, demon has been translated as devil or devils which is a Greek word…diablos…but should read demon, demons, demonic.
It is said these demons are disembodied spirits which look for bodies to possess. In the accounts, where they are cast out of a human body and we have the one account where they begged to be put in some sort of body and thus were put into a herd of swine which then ran off a cliff. Matthew 8:31 It is though by some the demons killed the swine on purpose but others put forth the though that the pigs body was not suitable for habitation as is the human body? These are some things to certainly think about.
There are many passages listed in the Keyword Concordance showing, Jesus and his disciples casting demons out of people. The spirit world was very involved with humanity before Jesus came and much information was given about them during His ministry…also Paul had encounters with them also
Their habitation of these people caused them to be physically ill or handicapped in some way and also some were made mentally ill. While some were mediums and were given knowledge by the spirit that was either possessing them or using them which brought monetary profit to their owners. Some even proclaimed that Paul was an apostle of Jesus…speaking a truth. Acts 16:16-18.
And it seems they are able to know a true believer over a false as some who were not truly believers of Jesus and who tried to cast demons out in the name of Jesus were beaten up by the demons saying they knew Jesus and Paul but did not know them. Acts 19:13-16.
Some have put forth the idea that these spirits with no bodies are the sinning messengers of Genesis 6 who left their own habitation, (house, spiritual body) to cohabit with women and which we read of in Jude and 2 Peter were imprisoned in Tartarus. But if those at the time of the Noahic flood were put in prison, the spirits in Jesus day must have been from another source…perhaps they are from the second irruption in the land of Canaan of which Bullinger gave us so much information on…perhaps when the human body died the spirit left but was not allowed to take back their celestial body…and were confined to the earth?
The Jewish Talmud has a lot to say about that realm and its involvement with their nation. As well as every religion and culture in the world, having their own legends and myths on their experiences with the gods who interacted with them and who they then would worship and yet as previously discussed these stores in different culture are all very similar. I will say again, all legends and myths originated with an actual event or appearance of a spirit being and or information given to the humans they interacted with.
One article I read gave the thoughts from an old Jewish legend which said, not all of the disembodied spirits from those sinning messengers were imprisoned at the Noahic flood, but that God allowed 10% to stay free to interfere with humanity…as disembodied demonic workers for Satan….?
The Wikipedia Encyclopedia had this to say on the Nephilim from historical records
Nephilim in ancient texts outside the Torah….Several ancient works, including Enoch and Jubilees, expand on the narrative in the Torah, connecting the origin of the Nephilim with the fallen angles, and in particular with the Grigori…(watchers). Samyaza an angel of high rank is described as leading a rebel sect of angels in a descent to earth to instruct humans in righteousness. The tutelage went on for a few centuries, but soon the angels pined for the human females and began to instruct the women in magic and conjuring. The angels consummated their lust, and as result produced hybrid offspring…the Nephilim.
According to these texts, the fallen angels who begat the Nephilim were cast into Tartarus’/Gehenna a place of total darkness. However, Jubilees also states that God granted ten percent of the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim to remain after the flood as demons, to try to lead the human race astray (through idolatry), the occult, etc. until the final judgment.
These works describe the Nephilim as being gigantic in stature, with prodigious strength and immense appetites. Supposedly, upon devouring all of humankind’s resources, the Nephilim had begun to consume humans themselves and attacked and oppressed them, becoming the cause of massive destruction on the earth.
In the Hebrew Old Testament, there are a number of other words, like Nephilim and are sometimes translated as giants…Emnim…Hebrew for the fearful ones…Rephaim..Hebrew for the dead ones and Anakim for the long necked ones.”
But, lets look at another objection to the literal viewpoint…Aren’t we told angels do not marry?
There is another argument against the literal viewpoint; we need to look at, we have all have heard it said that Jesus said, angels do not marry so why would they or could they covet women? And was that the reason they took wives if they did so? I think we have already answered what the true motive would have been behind the literal viewpoint so we lets examine the words of Jesus, and we might find some insight to our question.. Matthew 22:30 “For in the resurrection, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.”
First we must consider the context of the question which was about a woman who had many husbands in her life, and so the question was to whom she would be the wife of after the resurrection. So Jesus answered and said those in the resurrection would not marry but will be as the angels of God in heaven, so the subject was not about whether angels marry or not but was of humans in the resurrection and of course Jesus was speaking of the resurrection on this earth as the resurrection to a heavenly life was still a secret.
So to be truly literal, Jesus did not say Angels don’t marry but that those raised on this earth will be as or like or equal to the angels having a spiritual body which is borne out in the other texts which are related to this same incidence, Please lets also read Mark 12:25 and Luke 20:35 and see if any other information is given.
Mark 12:24,25 “Jesus averred to them, Are you not therefore deceived, not being acquainted with the scriptures, nor yet the power of God? For whenever they may be rising from among the dead, they are neither marrying nor taking out in marriage, but are as the messengers in the heavens.”
Luke 20:34, 35 “And, answering, Jesus said to them, ‘the sons of this eon are marrying and are taking out in marriage. Yet those deemed worthy to happen upon that eon and the resurrection from among the dead are neither marrying nor taking out in marriage. For neither can they still be dying, for they are equal to messengers, and are the sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.”
Now Luke has added a bit more detail and ties the likeness to messengers in that those raised will not be dying…but that they will be equal with messengers in this way. Angels or messengers do not grow old and die and neither do they marry or procreate as far as we know…but can we say that those words of Jesus would emphatically mean that they could not have done so? We are told they sinned because they left their natural habitation….and entered the human race to corrupt it.
Knoch did not accept that angels could marry women and produce offspring and gave the rule from Genesis 1:11 “the fruit bearing trees yielding fruit after its own kind” This after its own kind is repeated in Verses 12, 21, 24, 25 in regards to plant life and fowl, fish and animal life and yet after the creation of man at Verse 26-28…this is not said as perhaps because Eve was not yet created and when he was he was alone for a long enough period of time to name all the animals and to then recognize that he did not have a mate. Also DNA governs that humans and animals, fowl, fish and plants cannot reproduce together.
I think those words after their own kind are a law of the science or genetics of the individual creation stating a fact of a pre programmed rule of specific DNA and that each is programmed with the capacity to reproduce its own kind. But as we know some fruits and vegetables have been crossbred and produced a new form of fruit or vegetable and the same has been done with flowers. There is crossbreeding within a species of animals like dogs with dogs and cats with cats but none between dogs and cats. Something was programmed into the DNA by God concerning these things for sure.
The science of DNA is still progressing as they learn more and more about it, and is a fascinating subject of the building blocks of life, the more learned the more it is obvious of the divine design behind it all. I recently read that each tree even of the same kind or species will have its own specific DNA and yet that which also identifies its particular species of tree and this seems to be true with all creation…mind boggling. Humans have their own fingerprints and voice rhythms which specifically individually identify each person as well as family DNA and also that which takes each person back to the original human pair.
So, the question on the subject of angels and humans was, are they different species? If we are a species separate from spirit beings then it would seem that rule, after its own kind, would apply but what if we aren’t what if the difference is merely our bodies, fleshly versus spiritual?
About five years ago I first read the article written by Alexander Thomson who agreed with Bullinger on the literal view, of Genesis 6 and in this article he put forth why he believed that angels and men are of one species. That caught my attention and he refers to the verse in Acts 17:29 “For of that race are we, the race, then is inherently of God;” This passage is also translated as that we are Gods kin, race or offspring.
His complete article can be found on the website. www.geocites.org/tws490/ There are some things this brother said in his article that are hard to understand as it seems he did not thoroughly rightly divide but I felt his view of Paul’s words at Acts 17:28, 29 was interesting and needed looking into and so I have taken some of those thoughts for us to look at in our study. I did delete that which does not agree with our views rightly divided and which did not seem to add to the information on, this subject of could messengers cohabit with mortal women and produce children?
Alexander Thomson lived in England and was a contemporary of A. E. Knoch whose expertise in languages was known by Knoch and Thomson helped edit the Concordant Translation early on.
Thomson wrote for the Differentiator Publication which was similar to the Unsearchable Riches and in it was this article “Angels and Men One Species?”
ANGELS AND MEN ONE SPECIES?
Vol. 25 New Series December, 1964 No. 6
“In the Bible we are introduced to three, great types of intelligent and moral beings, Angels, Devils, and Men. And these, though possessing many attributes in common, they differ very widely in their physical constitution. A careful examination, however, of the various statements regarding them, contained in Scripture, leads us to the conclusion that, like the worm, the chrysalis, and the butterfly, they are different states or stages in the development of the same species; and that throughout the universe there is but one type and one law of development among the sons of God.”
“In Adam we have a specimen of the species in its primary state, possessing the natural or animal body, the corpus animale or "soma psuchikon" of Paul (1. Cor. 15:44, soulish body), by means of which propagation takes place. Also he is capable of being changed 'in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye,' into his complete development, possessing a spiritual body (the "sOma pneumaticon" of Paul), like the celestial bodies of the angels of heaven.”
Jesus said that the children of the resurrection become “were to become equal to the angels." (We must apply this to Israel as this was Jesus words concerning their resurrection on the earth.)
“When, God said, Let us make man in our own image, Adam was, indeed, created with the natural body, but Paul tells us that there is also going to be a spiritual body, and that the progression is—"first the natural body, and afterwards that which is spiritual."
“Although the Bible was not given to us to gratify curiosity, or to give lessons in natural science, it could not deliver its message without informing us of this; and, in order to give us some idea of the spiritual body which Christ has promised the new administration. (According to Paul we shall be above the angels.)
“Beyond the fact that the angels have spiritual bodies, and are from heaven, Scripture does not warrant the supposition that their nature is in the slightest degree different from our own. The word angel does not imply any constitutional difference, as in our language it seems to do. It expresses an office, not the distinction of a species, and is applied to men in the natural body as well as in the spiritual.
The word "messenger," when it occurs in the New Testament (except in two passages, where it should not be so translated), is no other than the word "angel." John the Baptist is thrice called an angelos—Matt. 11:10; Mark 1:2; and Luke 7:27; and the messengers whom he sent to Christ when he was in prison were called angeloi, Luke 7:24. The spies that were lodged in Rahab's house were angeloi, James 2:25; and when Christ set His face steadfastly to go to Jerusalem, He sent angeloi into the village of the Samaritans to make ready for Him, Luke 9:52.”
“But if men are called angels in Scripture, angels are much more frequently called men. They were not mere optical illusions, deluding men's senses, and appearing to be what they really were not. Scripture, it will be observed, never casts doubts on the evidence of the senses, because it is the highest which we possess. It does indeed inform us that there are many things around us which we do not see; and in order to reveal that which cannot be perceived by the senses, visions and dreams are super added; but we never find any suspicion cast on the evidence of the senses.”
“Their testimony is sacred, and is always appealed to as the basis on which all revealed religion rests, so that if that be shaken, all must go. "That which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and Our hands have handled, of the Word of life; that which we have seen and heard declare we unto you." This was the ground of the beloved apostle's testimony, and Christ Himself appeals to the evidence of sense in proof of His resurrection, when He says, "Handle me and see, for a spirit has not flesh and bones as ye see me have." (This statement should alert us that there is a difference between a spirit and a spiritual body….a spirit has no body and we want to know why?)
What better proof then, can we have that the angels have flesh and bones, than, that they were handled, and seen, and heard by men and women, who could not be mistaken as to the reality of their bodies, although for a time they were mistaken in supposing that they were ordinary men”
“It will be hereafter shown that the devils are disembodied spirits; and though we are informed that they are the "angels" that kept not their first estate; this does not prove that angels are spirits only. We must not hastily conclude that angels are unembodied spirits, like the devils, because in one passage it is said that they are all "ministering spirits." The emphasis lies not on the word "spirits" but on the word "ministering," just as in the corresponding passage Christ is said to be a "quickening spirit"—the emphasis lying on the word "quickening," not on the word "spirit." In both cases the word spirit is not without deep meaning, although that meaning is in our English translation shrouded.”
“It will be observed that in the case of Christ, He is contrasted with Adam, and as Christ is called a spirit so is Adam called a soul, and yet both had bodies. The angels are called spirits, Christ is called a spirit, and Adam is called a soul; but a soul is as immaterial as a spirit, and therefore any argument drawn from the expression "ministering spirits," to show that angels have no bodies, would be equally effectual to prove that Adam was a soul without a body, and that Christ was a spirit and nothing more.
In the verse immediately preceding we have the key to both passages, 1. Cor. 15:44"It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural (or soulish) body, and there is a spiritual body."
“The words "natural body" ought to have been translated "soul-body," because we have no adjective in English for soul corresponding with the adjective spiritual for spirit. Perhaps the most intelligible rendering which we could give to the passage would be by converting the words soul and spirit into adjectives in the 44th verse, and then reconverting them into substantives in the 45th, thus,—"It is sown a soul-body, it is raised a spirit-body. There is a soul-body, and there is a spirit-body. And so it is written. The first man Adam became a living soul, the last Adam a vivifying Spirit."
“Here then we have an explanation of the words "ministering spirits" as applied to angels. It means that they have not soul-bodies, but spirit-bodies; so that as Adam was a living soul, because he was possessed of a soul-body, the angels are called ministering spirits, because they are possessed of spirit-bodies.”
“This shows the danger of building scientific conclusions on the mere words of Scripture: it is the facts and arguments alone that will safely bear them; and turning to facts, we have the most convincing proofs that the angels are possessed of bodies as real as our own.”
“We have said that angels are much more frequently called men than men are called angels; because if we look at those passages in which the missions of angels are recorded, we shall find not only that the acts and experiences of the angels are sufficient to prove that they are real men, but that the very name "men" is applied to them, as being appropriate to their nature.”
“For example, the first recorded visit of angels to the Old Testament saints is to be found in the 18th chapter of Genesis, and there they are introduced at once as men:—"Abraham lifted up his eyes and looked, and lo, three men stood by him;" and throughout the whole narrative they are uniformly called men, and never angels.”
“Their actions, too proved that they were men, and if in any of their actions a supernatural power is exerted, it was only because they had supernatural bodies—that is to say, they had "spiritual bodies" for as our natural bodies are sown in corruption and weakness, and raised in incorruption and in power, so these "men" possessed of spiritual bodies, were already endowed with incorruption and with power.”
“And yet these spiritual bodies spoke and walked, and ate and were handled, like other men. They rested under the tree; they permitted Abraham to wash their feet; they allowed Sarah to bake upon the hearth cakes of three measures of meal, and Abraham to kill a calf, tender and good, for their refreshment; and when all was prepared, Abraham brought the calf and the cakes, and butter and milk besides, and set them before them, AND THEY DID EAT.”
“We must be careful how we reject evidence of this kind, lest in doing so we destroy the evidence of by far the most important dogma of the Christian faith. What evidence have we of the resurrection of the Lord, if the testimony of the senses be rejected? And if Christ be not risen, then is our faith vain. What evidence have we of the resurrection of Christ but that of the senses? He was seen, He was heard, He was handled; what more convincing proof could there be?”
“He said, "Handle me and see, for a spirit has not flesh and bones as ye see me have." And while they believed not for joy, He said to them, "Have ye here any meat?" And now comes the crowning evidence. "They gave Him a piece of a broiled fish and of a honeycomb, and HE DID EAT BEFORE THEM." “And why did He eat? Not because He was hungry or needed food, but to give the most convincing evidence that could be given that He had a real body.”
“They might be foolish enough to think that a spirit might speak and walk and be handled like mortal men, but none of them could be so foolish as to suppose that a spirit could eat a piece of a broiled fish and honeycomb. Surely, that which was sufficient to prove that Christ had a real body of flesh and bones, and is sufficient to prove that angels also are possessed of the same.”
“We have not the slightest warrant in Scripture for believing that there are any created spirits without bodies where there has been no death; and there can be no death where there has been no sin. We do not affirm that there are no unfallen spirits; heaven is not a phantom locality, like the heathen Elysium or the Mohammedan paradise. It is a real locality, to which Christ ascended with a real body. It is the world upon which the angels with their spiritual bodies have been dwelling for thousands of years and it is yet destined to receive a multitude of resurrection saints whom no man can number.
There are spirits, but God did not make them so: they became spirits because of their sin; for if they had not sinned they should never have died. As a human skeleton is the product of sin and death so also is a disembodied spirit, because neither of them could have existed if sin and death had been unknown? (Is this what Jude 14 was talking about, the straying stars, and dying twice…the next death would be the second death of Revelation?)
There are unembodied spirits, but instead of being of a higher order, they are in reality of a lower, or rather they are the abnormal products of a fall. Who will say that the devils belong to a higher species than the angels, or the resurrection saints, or the Son of God Himself, who sits, a real and living man, the son of Abraham, the son of David, upon the throne of the universe?
If an unembodied spirit be higher in the scale of creation than a being having a spiritual body, then the dead are higher now than they shall be hereafter, and would be reduced to an inferior state of existence by means of the resurrection.”
“Observe how the argument stands. Angels and devils were once alike in nature; how unreasonable is it to suppose that the unclean spirits alone have kept their first estate, and continued to be spirits; whereas the angels of heaven have fallen from their high estate, and having become like men with bodies, have been mistaken for men, and been entertained unawares?”
If the constitution of the angels and the devils was at one time identical, and if the angels have not been degraded in their constitution, then it necessarily follows that the devils at one time had bodies, and that they walked, and spoke, and ate like men—and their disembodied spirits remain upon the planet which their sins defiled; and those geological discoveries of ancient humanity which have awakened so much interest in the scientific world, may have also a theological value in confirming this view of Satanic natural history.”
“We never find an angel inhabiting the bodies of men, either for good or evil. It is somewhat remarkable that the unclean spirits are found to fit into the organism of our natural bodies exactly in the same manner as our own spirits do, influencing their actions, and in many instances using the bodies of living men as if they were their own: in fact, a disembodied spirit, ejected by death from its own proper "habitation," and earnestly desiring to be clothed upon, could not be conceived to be in any respect different from these unclean spirits, either in their nature or their habits.”
“Their physical correspondence with the vertebrate physiology of the human body is further illustrated by their entering and energizing the bodies of the swine at Gadara; although it is evident, from the catastrophe that followed, that the difference was too great, and that the attempt was a failure. They succeeded in obtaining a lodgment, but they found that the bodies of the swine did not sufficiently correspond with their spirit functions to enable them to direct or control their movements.
The disembodied spirits got into the saddle, as it were, but could not grasp the reins. Spirits such as they are seem to be fitted for the human body, perhaps because they left the spiritual man body as messengers but they were not fitted for the bodies of the swine; and accordingly, the moment they took possession, the frightened animals ran down a steep place into the sea, and were choked in the waters—a consummation which the unclean spirits evidently did not anticipate, and which would issue in their being again unclothed.”
“Here, then, we see that the natural constitution of the spirits fits them for entering into the bodies of men, and sharing with their own proper spirit the government and use of the body. It is, in fact, an appetite which their imperfect nature must ever feel: fearing to be cast out into the deep; seeking rest in human organisms, and disappointed when they cannot find it. This is according to the nature of a spirit, but where do we find anything of this kind in the angel? There is no more appearance of an angel being able to possess a man, than of one man being able to dwell in the body of another.”
“It is of great importance to ascertain that the angels have spiritual bodies, because we are told that at the resurrection, those of the earthly resurrection shall be "equal to the angels"; and unless we had testimony regarding the appearance, powers, and capabilities of the angels, we should not have been able to form any conception of the nature of the resurrection bodies of the saints”
“We are told that our resurrection bodies are to be like His. “Our mortal bodies shall be fashioned like unto His glorious body," and "we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is." (Now this information is from Paul and for the body of Christ, we shall be given a celestial glory while Israel a terrestrial glory and that would seem to indicate a slight difference in our bodies in resurrection?)
A little more information on the Book of Enoch
Those who have studied the book of Enoch state that it is in fact a book of prophesy and was written before the flood of Noah as it foretold it and then it is filled with prophecy of the end times or tribulation time which Noah’s day prefigures. I will again say, the only problem I have with this book is how and or who translated it as it follows the pattern of the KJAV…any mention of fire and of course the interpretation is hell. But we must remember Jude quoted from it which gives it credibility.
Here is a little more history on this book that I found, Graham Hancock, in the Sign and the Seal, said, “It is said prior to the eighteenth century, scholars believed the Book of Enoch to be irretrievable lost…it was compiled long before the birth of Christ and consider to one of the most important pieces of Jewish mystical literature, it was only from fragments and references to it in other texts. James Bruce found copies of it in Ethiopia. These were the first complete editions of the Book of Enoch ever to be seen in Europe.”
Andrew Collins in his work, From the Ashes of Angels…The forbidden legacy of a Fallen Race…1996 says, “The Book of Enoch remained in darkness until 1821, when the long years of dedicated work by a professor of Hebrew at the University of Oxford were finally rewarded with the publication of the first ever English translation of the Book of Enoch. The Reverend Richard Laurence, Archbishop of Cashel, had labored for many hundreds of hours over the faded manuscript in the hands of the Bodleian Library, carefully substituting English words and expressions from the original *Geez, while comparing the result with known extracts, such as the few brief chapters preserved in Greek by Syncellus during the ninth century.”
*Ge'ez ..Gəʿəz, IPA: [ɡɨʕɨz]; also transliterated Gi'iz, and referred to as Ethiopic) is an ancient South Semitic language that developed in the current region of Eritrea and northern Ethiopia in the Horn of Africa. It later became the official language of the Kingdom of Aksum and Ethiopian imperial court.
Milik Jazef…in his work, on the Book of Enoch, “Aramaic Fragments of Qumran Cave 4” says “The original Aramaic version was lost until the Dead Seas fragments were discovered…The original language of most of this work was, in all likelihood, Aramaic…an early Semitic language…Although the original version was lost in antiquity, portions of a Greek translation were discovered in Egypt and quotations were known from the Church Fathers. The discovery of texts from Qumran Cave 4 has finally provided parts of the Aramaic original…”
So, one question we might ask, did Noah or Enoch know how to write and did he carry writings onto the ark with him? It is thought that there were some in that time who wrote things down about the creation and it was from these that Moses then compiled Genesis. While others have scoffed as they did not believe man had the ability to write and yet… and more archeological findings are showing even in the most primitive of peoples they had some form of writing or drawing telling their story.
There is also reported to have been a book of Noah, said in secular Jewish history to have been kept in the second temple in Israel. So these would have to of been taken onto the ark with Noah So lets reason on this, before the flood, mankind all spoke Hebrew, as the other languages were not given by God until after the flood of Noah and at the tower of Babel. Genesis 11:1-9
I would think, since they spoke Hebrew they would also know how to write it. Adam named the animals…showing us Adam possessed intelligence and a knowledge of words or language. So I thought I would look at the Hebrew language and found many having close ties with Hebrew such as the Aramaic, Chaldee, Egyptian and Persian. From these then sprang others.
The Hebrew language consisted originally only of consonants and a 22 letter alphabet. The reader of this language supplied the vowels when speaking it, a really far more advanced language than we who think we are so smart have today. From what I can find, the masses did not write or know how to read, but there were those who did….and years later these who are said to be scribes began to use a couple vowels and over time making Hebrew readable and writable for the masses. So perhaps the ability to write Hebrew had originally been a gift from God….or….the watchers may have taught some humans how to write their language.
It almost sounds like in the Book of Enoch, that these watchers were suppose to be helpers to humanity teaching them things that would help be beneficial but when they began to overstep their bounds and accept worship from these humans they were teaching and some deciding to marry women and have children they then also taught them things which were not beneficial but harmful.
The Book of Enoch explains that the watchers gave them knowledge of the stars and their names, their names and places in the solar system as many pictures of the solar systems have been found of the primary stars as well as planets with names not found until man invented the telescope. So, this would have been the first astronomy and Enoch writes that they taught the women they took for wives, the use of herbs, for cooking, medicines and poisons which became the beginnings of witchcraft.
After the flood, and with the giving of other languages at Babel which caused these people to scatter out and form new nations…such as the Sumerians, Egyptians, Babylonians and other nationalities that developed, they on their own or with the help of the spirit beings who continued to be involved with humanity would have developed their own alphabets for writing on their own or by the angels interacting again with humans.
This is how Egypt got so many gods, they did not imagine them…they interacted with spirit men who were gods and as inferior humans they worshipped them…their principle Sun god was Ra but it is reported they had thousands of lesser gods. Babylon also Baal as their main god but had many others gods as did all the other nations.
There is evidence found in archeology of how these different groups of peoples which scattered when the languages were confused by God communicated with each other. Some with pictures or symbols and there is evidence of alphabets in the different languages and so it is thought…the gods which led these nations in idolatry before and after the flood, giving them a false religion would have instructed them in many other sciences and mathematics also. In the legends…these gods fought amongst themselves and this is most likely true….and why some nations advanced more than others. If I had another lifetime, I would do more research on these things but for now….I would just be happy to finish the articles I have begun.
So getting back to the book of Enoch, with Jude quoting from it, and the other scriptural evidence in Hebrews 11 that Enoch was a man of God, given faith and strength to be a prophet gives us room for the questions as to why this book was not included in what we know today as the Bible?
This information about Enoch made me curious and so I found a translation of the book of Enoch on line. As I said it was uncovered and translated in the early 1900’s and parts of it have been found among the Dead Sea scrolls which were written in Aramaic showing copies of it were made by Jewish scribes. In my research on it so far, I find that it was also read and accepted as inspired by the early church into the 2nd and 3rd centuries and only later discarded as being not inspired.
But we have read that Jude 14 is quoted from the book of Enoch and if it were not inspired or reliable history I doubt Jude would have quoted from it. By the 2nd and 3rd centuries, the church was corrupted and the counsel from Paul for rightly dividing was lost and with it recognizing prophecy for Israel was still unfulfilled until time for Jehovah to return to his business with Israel with spiritualizing scripture becoming the standard interpretation for Bible
The Catholic Church took authority as to what doctrine was allowed to be taught and deciding which scriptures should be considered as inspired and they looked to Peter as their guide or apostle and so they could not understand much because they were following the wrong Apostle.
Their hatred for the Jews rejection of Jesus also contributed to the teaching that Israel was cast off forever and so those are the reason which may have been behind the rejection of the book of Enoch. As those who have studied it feel it first spoke of the days in which Enoch lived but then he gave prophecies for the latter days and the end time of tribulation before Christ returns with the final judgments for these straying star, or sinning messengers. It appears to be written for the Jews of the future end times after we are gone from this earth and of course the Catholic Church would reject it as they think Christ came in A.D. 70!
Those not believing in a literal return of Christ would discount it. Their main focus was that they were the church and only through it could one get to heaven….going through purgatory first and that those who would not join the Catholic Church would burn in hell for eternity. The sects who broke away from the Catholic Church kept many of these blasphemous doctrines and the church worldwide is still in darkness.
The only question I have with the book of Enoch, has to do with the translating of it, my thoughts are that it seems to follow the pattern of the King James and so for me without the knowledge of Hebrew and or Aramaic I cannot judge as to its accuracy except when it contradicts God Word, for example when there is talk of fire, and the punishment ahead for the sinning angles… the theology of the translator takes over and interprets this be the teaching on a hell and punishment there, like the King James does.
But I did find it interesting that in it, he speaks at length of the angels which came down and married the mortal women, adding details not found in the Genesis account. He writes of these messengers in the light of it being normal and common every day occurrence for humanity in those times to interact with them. He states 200 hundred of these chiefs joined in a pact to leave the spirit realm and that they had those under them, he gives the names of 10 angelic chiefs who each had 10 angels under them.
He tells of the wickedness of the offspring from this unnatural union and as I said earlier it appears that Peter refers to these same events in the days of Noah at 2 Peter 2:4,5 We are not told of any other incident or event in which God locked up sinning angels other than as Jude refers to and being in the same time frame, the days of Noah, it would be logical they both are talking about what is said in Genesis 6:1-4
We who are called into the Body of Christ are told by Paul that we have been called to the celestial realm which means, that one day our mortal flesh will put on immortality becoming a spiritual body just like Christ’s and filled with the spirit of God. 1 Corinthians 15:38-54 John 4:24. God will change our fleshly bodies to spiritual bodies.
We can also compare this with what Jesus told the disciples whose hope was to be in the earthly resurrection on this earth…that they would be like angels which means equal to angels in power or glory and Paul explains this in 1 Corinthians 15:46 to be “the terrestrial glory” while Paul told us we shall be above the angels and that ours will be “the celestial glory” as “our home is inherently in the celestials” Philippians 3:20
We might now look at the words of Jesus at Matthew 24:37-39
In the context of this passage Verse 3 sets the scene, “And as He sat upon the mount of Olives the disciples came unto Him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be and what shall be the sign of Thy coming and of the end of this age?” Jesus was talking to those of the bride church, as nothing was known of the Body of Christ or of the new administration or the dispensation of Grace at that time. These men were only concerned with when Jesus would return to them and set up His messianic kingdom.
Jesus gave his disciples some signs which would show the time was near for the end of this age and thus His arrival and then ended with these words, “But as the days of Noah were, so shall the coming of the Son of Man be, For as in the days, that were before the flood, they were eating and drinking , marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and knew not until the flood came and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of Man be.”
There are several things to learn from what Jesus said, in reference to the days before the Noahic flood His words confirms the account given in Genesis as scriptural and not a myth. Next note nothing is said about homosexuality in fact just the opposite, they were marrying and giving in marriage. Next his disciples are told that conditions in the world before His return would be similar to the days of Noah….and also His arrival would take most in the world by surprise.
So I ask this question, why would the saints living in the end times be told that conditions would be similar to the marrying and giving in marriage if the terrible sin of Noah’s day was the intermarriage of Seth’s and Cain’s lines? Those lines would no longer be an issue…the seed of the woman has come and given His life for humanity, the redemption work is done. In the latter days, the nation of Israel will have been restored; there would be no rule against Cain’s and Seth’s sons and daughter marrying in the end times.
We are told in Revelation 12 that Satan and 1/3 of the messengers who have followed him will be cast down to this earth, confined here…perhaps what was done in the days before the flood by these sinning messengers will occur again during those last 3 ½ years before Christ returns?
Hopefully we have established in this study, there are no scriptural indications that these two lines were ever told not to marry and that the sin of that day was the mixing of these two sons lines. So for me this is the final nail in the coffin of the Sethite theory and sheds more light onto the actual sin that was going on in those days….which needed such drastic measures in order to rid the world of the participants of it.
Why would the intermarriage of Seth and Cain cause God to wipe out all the animal life on the earth also? All flesh it says was corrupted and the stories of legend and the historical accounts referring to those legends indicate somehow the animals had been interfered with as well as cannibalism by the Nephilim.
Add to this, as well, at the flood, the need for Christ to come with 10 thousand of His messengers to deal with, not the humans drowning in the flood waters but to capture and imprison the sinning messengers (the straying or wandering stars of Jude) who had left their own natural estate or habitation as we learned was leaving a spiritual body and taking on a fleshly human body, and then to escape drowning they would have been leaving the human bodies they had assumed. Jude 14
These then are the spirits with no bodies plaguing mankind in Jesus day and so perhaps these are those who then caused the second irruption….corrupting humans in the land of Canaan while waiting for Israel’s arrival.
It is likely that the satanic interference will take on the same type of activity as in the days of Noah, as Satan and his messengers will be cast out of heaven and confined to this earth for 1260 days or 42 months both relating to the same time period of the last 3 ½ years of the seventy weeks given in Daniels Prophecy for the latter days. Revelation 12:9,10 Verse 17 shows “ the dragon is angry with woman and does battle with the rest of her seed, those who are keeping the precepts of God and who have the testimony of Jesus.” Revelation 13:5b for forty two months
So what was foretold in Genesis 3:15 that the seed of the woman would crush Satan’s head and all through the Bible we find accounts of Satan at work as the adversary trying to thwart that prophecy of his own demise and we find its fulfillment foretold in Revelation 11:15-17 and 16:15,16, of which even Paul spoke of Christ’s arrival to the earth in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10 followed by Satan being given his crushing blow, his organization of demons and men rendered powerless, he will be locked away in the abyss with the sinning messengers already there.
After Christ arrives and Satan is placed in the abyss for 1000 years, then will be the Glory Throne judgment on this earth for the nations of the world of which Jesus spoke of at Matthew 25:31-46 and they will be judged on how they treated His brethren which is Israel.
When Satan’s1000 years in the abyss are over, he will be released for a short time and he will rouse up the unbelieving nations in another attack on Israel. This shows us that even with a perfect government in office, false religion exposed and Satan not around to deceive many will have not come to Christ.
That rebellion will be short lived and then Satan will be thrown into the lake of fire for his rehabilitation. Revelation 19:1-7. 20: 1-3, 7-10. Then will be the time for the Great White Throne judgment for the rest of the dead, this is the third resurrection but the second one on the earth. Revelation 20:5,6 Followed by Gods day or the new heavens and new earth wherein righteousness will dwell and death will be no more. Revelation 21
God promises to make all things new and all things includes Satan and his demons! They are part of His creation and will not be lost as God is not only powerful by merciful and receives far more glory for reconciling His enemies than saving His saints as well as nothing is impossible for Him….except to fail….that word is not in His vocabulary…contrary to the teachings of men….but lets always remember Paul’s words at Romans 3:4… God be found true though every man a liar!
It seems to me the evidence in favor of the literal viewpoint of Genesis 6:1-4 far outweighs the lack of evidence for the pre adamic race or the Sethite view adopted by the Catholic Church in the 5th century. And I fear Knoch made his translation using sons of alueim and their offspring as the distinguished ones based on the Sethite teaching and I cannot accept it at this time…I would have to have more evidence to understand why he did so.